[00:00.000 --> 00:08.460] Now, I do have some written things up here but these two speakers are two of the best that [00:08.460 --> 00:13.920] we've had and I feel if I would give them an introduction it would be an insult. So here [00:13.920 --> 00:19.380] today, uh, speaking on how your doctor might be trying to kill you and how personal [00:19.380 --> 00:24.060] genomics can save your life, ladies and gentlemen, Jen and Darren. [00:26.060 --> 00:33.980] Thanks a lot. Alright, so indeed, how your doctor might be trying to kill you and how [00:33.980 --> 00:39.280] personal genomics can save your life. So, just real quick, the idea here is that personal [00:39.280 --> 00:47.600] medicine, the drive to own your health a little bit more and working with your doctor is a [00:47.600 --> 00:52.080] big deal. You know, it's a half hour talk, we just want to provide a couple of anecdotes [00:52.080 --> 00:56.560] to kind of drive that point home a little bit. And along the way also, maybe give you some [00:56.560 --> 01:03.120] ideas and some information related to genomics and how you can help yourself down that [01:03.120 --> 01:11.980] path. So, the obligatory disclaimer, we're not doctors and we are not working for our [01:11.980 --> 01:16.340] company right now, so. And I'm going to hand it over to Mike, or to Mike, I'm going to hand the [01:16.340 --> 01:23.340] mic over to Jen. Thank you. So, before we really get into some of the details, there are [01:23.340 --> 01:28.660] some basics that we should go over, just some terminology. Genome sequencing, when you [01:28.660 --> 01:34.420] see commercials like 23andMe, they're sequencing parts of your DNA. That's how you get [01:34.420 --> 01:40.140] information about your genome. Something that they will give you is called SNPs, single [01:40.140 --> 01:46.320] nucleotide polymorphisms. The way to remember this is just, is where you vary from [01:46.320 --> 01:53.540] what is considered normal. So, your SNP might be that you have a variant that is defective or [01:53.540 --> 01:58.960] just not normal. And then you have personalized medicine, or precision medicine. This is [01:58.960 --> 02:04.960] tailoring your medical prescription based on your DNA, based on your genetic code. And [02:04.960 --> 02:10.480] then there's gene expression. Just because you have some malfunction or some DNA [02:10.480 --> 02:15.460] variance does not mean it will actually be expressed. There's turning on of genes and [02:15.460 --> 02:18.660] turning off of genes. Just because you have something doesn't mean it will actually [02:18.660 --> 02:24.320] express or show. And then we have epigenetics. Your environment, things that you consume, [02:24.320 --> 02:29.240] alcohol, tobacco, can also affect you at a DNA level. It's very important to know because [02:29.240 --> 02:34.340] if you're going to explore your own genome, you'll want to be very familiar that just [02:34.340 --> 02:39.400] because it says you have something that might be defective does not mean you actually [02:39.400 --> 02:47.320] have it. So, I want to share with you an experience that I've had with my personal [02:47.320 --> 02:54.640] genome and how it's affected my life. About ten years ago, one day, I developed a very [02:54.640 --> 03:00.540] severe headache. So severe, in fact, that when I went to bed, I was hoping and praying, [03:00.540 --> 03:05.640] please let me wake up in the morning. Now, here's a tip. If you're going to bed praying [03:05.640 --> 03:10.320] that you wake up in the morning, you should probably be going to the hospital. But I just [03:10.320 --> 03:15.620] want to shake it off. I got this. And I tried to go to sleep until about five in the morning. [03:15.620 --> 03:21.800] It was very clear I needed medical attention immediately. So, rushed to the emergency room. [03:21.800 --> 03:27.220] I got there. I'm in such excruciating pain, I can't even answer my doctor's questions. [03:27.220 --> 03:33.320] I can't even communicate with my doctor. So, they give me a really, really good sedative, [03:33.320 --> 03:40.140] gave me a good dose of Dilaudid, put me in an MRI, and took some pretty pictures. Here [03:40.140 --> 03:45.980] are two of them. This is my brain. And as I come out of the MRI, feeling really good [03:45.980 --> 03:52.920] on Dilaudid, my doctor tells me, you have a two-inch blood clot in your brain. If you [03:52.920 --> 04:00.820] did not get here by now, you would be dead. So, I wonder, how did this happen? As did [04:00.820 --> 04:05.780] my doctor, being of a somewhat young age, developing a blood clot that large in your [04:05.780 --> 04:13.380] brain is not exactly normal. So, he does some basic genetic testing on me, takes about [04:13.380 --> 04:19.980] 15 vials of blood, and comes back and tells me that, you know those commercials where [04:19.980 --> 04:24.140] they tell you about medicine and it's about two seconds worth telling you what the medicine [04:24.140 --> 04:28.680] does and the rest of the time it's telling you how it could kill you, how you shouldn't [04:28.680 --> 04:34.920] take it with certain defects or certain, with alcohol or breathing oxygen. There's a reason [04:34.920 --> 04:41.360] for that. This is a typical medical disclaimer regarding birth control pills. And there's [04:41.480 --> 04:46.840] a lot here, but what's hidden in there, you should not take birth controls if you have [04:46.980 --> 04:52.620] a hereditary or acquired predisposition for blood clots. Well, how do you even know if [04:52.620 --> 04:58.260] you do? If you haven't had your genetic testing done, you have no idea. So, you might be taking [04:58.260 --> 05:04.240] medicine or pills or even vitamins that could actually be hurting you when you're not knowing [05:04.240 --> 05:09.340] it. So, this is exactly what I had. I had been taking birth control pills and I had [05:09.560 --> 05:15.040] a hereditary or acquired predisposition. My doctor comes to me and says, congratulations, [05:15.040 --> 05:23.700] your homozygous C677T for MTHFR genetic mutation. What? What is that? So, he tries to explain [05:23.700 --> 05:29.760] to me that it's something that a lot of people have and that there is this pathway here. [05:29.760 --> 05:35.420] I'm not going to go into the details. This, everyone has, and this is responsible for [05:35.420 --> 05:40.580] many things. When this works properly, it is responsible for making DNA, maintaining [05:40.580 --> 05:46.540] your DNA, repairing your DNA, regulating gene expression, that's the turning on and off [05:46.540 --> 05:52.440] of genes, regulating hormone function, regulating histamine levels. It's responsible for a lot [05:52.440 --> 05:59.080] of really important things in your life. So, when this isn't working, what could go wrong? [05:59.380 --> 06:08.540] Well, apparently a lot. And this isn't even everything. If you have these mutations and [06:08.540 --> 06:14.900] if you do not have the proper balance in that pathway, you could be under-methylating, not [06:14.900 --> 06:20.740] producing enough, or over, and that's too much. So, there's no balance there. You could [06:20.740 --> 06:27.320] have any one of these things, including blood clots, which is, lucky for me, what I had. [06:27.600 --> 06:35.440] So, I had some questions, and this is actually what my pathway looks like. And in medical [06:35.440 --> 06:42.020] terms, this is called severely jacked up. This is not good. So, I do what I refer to [06:42.020 --> 06:49.740] as under-methylating. I don't do that properly. And so, my doctor says, here's what you've [06:49.740 --> 06:55.420] got to do. Can't smoke. Don't take birth control pills. And, you know what? You're of child-bearing [06:55.420 --> 07:00.600] age. Take some folic acid. Take some multivitamins, just as general advice the doctors give, and [07:00.600 --> 07:07.300] sends me on my way. Fortunately, I don't follow directions very well, and I hate taking pills, [07:07.300 --> 07:12.380] so I didn't listen to him. I did not take folic acid. I did not take multivitamins. [07:12.380 --> 07:17.640] And it's a good thing, because actually, he did not mean to kill me with this advice. [07:17.640 --> 07:22.980] I'm sure he didn't. I like to think he didn't. I think I paid my bills on time. But, what [07:22.980 --> 07:27.660] he was prescribing for me could potentially have killed me or put me back in the hospital. [07:27.860 --> 07:34.080] Because folic acid and multivitamins, in some forms, is actually poison to me. So, good [07:34.080 --> 07:38.860] thing I didn't listen. I had to have some dental work done. I went to the dentist, and [07:38.860 --> 07:43.480] Mr. Dentist says, hey, would you like some nitrous oxide for this? It will make you feel [07:43.480 --> 07:48.760] mellow, make it a little easier for the procedure. Sure. Give me some nitrous oxide. I want to [07:48.760 --> 07:54.100] feel mellow. I want to enjoy this procedure instead of being in pain. So, everything goes [07:54.100 --> 07:59.000] fine. Nothing happened. It was great, which is very fortunate, because there are many, [07:59.000 --> 08:04.120] many, many documented cases. People who did not know that they had some genetic defects [08:04.120 --> 08:09.380] that are contraindicative with nitrous oxide. And they did not leave the dentist office [08:09.840 --> 08:16.600] alive. So, fortunately, for me, I was fine. I had a friend who happens to have the same [08:17.180 --> 08:21.880] genetic mutation as I do. And I told her, I just went to the dentist. Fortunately for [08:21.880 --> 08:26.880] me, she was a lot more well-educated in our genetic mutation than I was at the time. And [08:26.880 --> 08:32.200] she told me, you need to research this. You need to really find out, because your doctor [08:32.200 --> 08:37.440] is giving you information that really is not helpful for you. And there's more that you [08:37.440 --> 08:43.240] need to learn. So, it's clear I needed to learn more about my DNA. What is that process [08:43.240 --> 08:50.580] like? So, this is where I jump in. So, I want to do the same thing. So, I'm like probably [08:50.800 --> 08:54.780] a zillion other people, probably a lot of other folks in this room. I wanted to check [08:54.780 --> 09:01.660] out one of these commercial, you know, companies and get my stuff looked at, see what I could [09:01.660 --> 09:05.700] find out. And, you know, I'm sure a lot of people have this kind of reasoning behind [09:05.700 --> 09:10.500] it as well. You can imagine folks that maybe are adopted or maybe think they're adopted [09:10.500 --> 09:15.900] or whatever. I have, my father's been out of the picture since I was like four. I know [09:15.900 --> 09:19.460] nothing about his family. So, I thought, you know, aside from all of the other sort of [09:19.460 --> 09:22.580] interesting things, maybe there's gaps there, there's interesting things there that might [09:22.580 --> 09:28.740] be medical-related kind of things that I might be able to discover and help fill that gap [09:28.880 --> 09:34.700] a little bit. So, I went and had it done. Oh, and let me mention too, and maybe some [09:34.700 --> 09:38.380] of you guys are the same way. Also, the ancestry side, I was kind of like, you know, it'd be [09:38.380 --> 09:44.940] very cool if I had some sort of hidden lineage, right? And, you know, I'm part like Cherokee [09:44.940 --> 09:50.160] or, you know, I have like East African descent or something crazy like that, right? So, I [09:50.160 --> 09:56.940] get all this done and I had that there as well. And so, one of the things, just so you [09:56.940 --> 10:02.480] know, and that's why I have the picture that came out of this, is that I'm really, really [10:02.480 --> 10:12.520] Caucasian. And it's... I was disappointingly Caucasian. I'm like translucent. I'm not [10:12.520 --> 10:18.740] entirely sure that you can get any more, you know, white European than that and I was truly [10:18.740 --> 10:25.100] disappointed. But the point I'm trying to make here is that you get all the information [10:25.100 --> 10:30.920] from there and it's a pretty good set of information. And oftentimes, you'll find a little [10:30.920 --> 10:34.400] tweak here, a little thing there that you're like, oh, you might have this thing or you might [10:34.400 --> 10:39.720] be carrying this thing or, you know, there's all the ancestry bits. But it is very consumer [10:39.720 --> 10:45.860] based, right? It's very high level. You can, in some cases, dig into things and I very much [10:45.860 --> 10:51.400] recommend that. But also, there's other places you can take that data. And that's the purpose [10:51.400 --> 10:57.900] here. If you look at the stuff above the line here, that's stuff from 23andMe. So, that's [10:57.900 --> 11:02.340] just a snippet of some of my information. Super high level, right? It's a, hey, variant not [11:02.340 --> 11:06.680] detected. You know, these items. Real easy to read, real easy to consume. I get that [11:06.680 --> 11:14.560] understanding. Nice. Side note, you can download all of the SNP data, the raw SNP data. And [11:14.560 --> 11:18.860] that's where, then you can take that raw SNP data and you can go and plug it into other [11:18.860 --> 11:27.220] places. This one down here is Code... Code... Code... Who knows? Codegent. So, this one [11:27.220 --> 11:30.060] down here is just an example of some of the stuff from Codegent. And it gives you an idea, [11:30.060 --> 11:35.840] right? So, the, uh, the point here is, is, uh, you see that increased risk of type 2 diabetes? [11:36.220 --> 11:43.080] That was nowhere in my, in my 23andMe one. So, different system, different analysis. You get [11:43.080 --> 11:46.720] some, some, fill in some gaps. It's kind of cool. Another thing you might notice with the [11:46.720 --> 11:53.320] search, look at the search bar. That's searching your SNPs for references to all kinds of [11:53.320 --> 12:00.540] things. Uh, chemicals, drugs, diseases, uh, and obviously the, the genes themselves. So, if you [12:00.540 --> 12:06.380] have a specific interest, hey, am, am I, is there issues with me drinking alcohol? Am I, am I [12:06.380 --> 12:12.180] predisposed to being an alcoholic? That might be a, a, an easy way to dig into it. Um, again, [12:12.180 --> 12:17.660] the point here is there are some simple places, simple ways you can get to, um, more data. You [12:17.660 --> 12:21.560] can fill your data up. You, I mean, you can, you can fill those gaps a little bit. And the [12:21.560 --> 12:25.360] nice thing about this one as well, you can dig in a little bit more deeply. You can drill in. Um, [12:25.360 --> 12:31.100] and there's, there's many, many more. Some of them are free. Some of them are not free. Um, so [12:31.100 --> 12:36.720] what, next, what's the moral of the story? Moral of the story is information is power, right? We [12:36.720 --> 12:40.460] all want, we want more information. Uh, the more information you have, the stronger you can [12:40.460 --> 12:47.800] be. But... Not just that, if you know your genetic code, if you know your predispositions, if I [12:47.800 --> 12:52.220] had known mine, perhaps I never would have taken those birth control pills and I wouldn't have [12:52.220 --> 12:57.980] ended up in the hospital. So if you know ahead of time, you're armed. Information is power. It's [12:57.980 --> 13:05.620] also not all, not all information is power. Um, me being the hacker mentality that I have, um, [13:05.620 --> 13:10.320] well my doctor doesn't really know what I need. I know my genetic code now, mostly. I'm gonna, [13:10.320 --> 13:14.820] I'm gonna fix this. So I go on the internet and I look at other people who've contributed [13:14.820 --> 13:20.040] information. This is what you need to do, this is how you get from under-methylating, like I am, [13:20.040 --> 13:27.000] to a normal state. So I can repair my DNA, I can do all of those good things. Well, it didn't [13:27.000 --> 13:33.280] work out so well for me there either. Um, I took all the right form of vitamins and, um, one day [13:33.280 --> 13:40.340] I'm taking these vitamins and I hit the floor. I pass out. Um, me not learning very quickly, I do [13:40.340 --> 13:45.700] it again the next day, I pass out. Clearly I need to stop taking these vitamins. I do and [13:45.700 --> 13:50.420] everything's fine. But what happened is I, I, I changed the balance. I under-methylated and then [13:50.420 --> 13:57.000] I over-methylated and it was just as bad. And in fact it was, it was very dangerous. So don't [13:57.000 --> 14:01.480] read everything, don't believe everything you read on the internet. Not because it's wrong, [14:01.480 --> 14:08.940] because it might be wrong for you. You need... Wait, what did I say? Did you just say don't [14:08.940 --> 14:18.720] believe everything you read on the internet? And so what's important to take here is, yeah, [14:18.720 --> 14:22.920] you need to be a steward of your own, your own health. You need to be educated. You need to be [14:22.920 --> 14:27.600] knowledgeable. But you also need to enlist the help of a really good doctor. One that is [14:27.600 --> 14:33.160] interested in helping you based on you. Not just what is normal. Um, they're really good at [14:33.160 --> 14:39.320] treating sick. They're not so good at treating you specifically. But you need to help them. And [14:39.320 --> 14:43.960] if you do that, you can, um, you can come to a much better place. [14:45.540 --> 14:50.460] I'll also make the point that the title of the slide is how, or the other of the talk is how [14:50.460 --> 14:55.800] your doctors are trying to kill you. Certainly hyperbole, the idea there is that you need to, [14:55.800 --> 15:03.160] uh, be the steward of your own, your own health. Uh, doctors are there to, to do that as well. [15:03.160 --> 15:08.180] Some doctors aren't, aren't hip to folks trying to help them out. And you know, maybe that, [15:08.180 --> 15:11.600] and if that's what you're looking for, then you need to find another doctor. [15:14.140 --> 15:18.560] A couple of, we want to touch on a couple of other things. Um, risk. Man, there are tons of [15:18.560 --> 15:23.780] risk, right? And, and I think that, that this, this set of things here could be a three hour [15:23.780 --> 15:29.480] panel discussion easily, right? Um, all of the ethical, uh, concerns, all of the security risk. [15:29.480 --> 15:37.040] Here's the thing. I, I, this company generated SNP data for me. They have it. I have it, which [15:37.040 --> 15:41.560] is nice. At least I have control of what I have. What control do they have? What are they going to [15:41.560 --> 15:46.000] do with it over time? Who do they share it with? What happens when they get bought by another [15:46.000 --> 15:49.960] company? What happens when the country that they're, that they're incorporated in gets, uh, [15:49.960 --> 15:54.120] has a military coup and is now a fascist company or, you know, our country, you know, all of these [15:54.120 --> 15:58.500] questions are, are significant questions and you have to ask yourself what you're comfortable with. [15:58.500 --> 16:07.000] You also have to ask yourself, you know, what's the risk versus reward? Is this something, um, [16:07.000 --> 16:11.780] these are difficult things, I think. Um, I don't, and we're not going to answer those things up [16:11.780 --> 16:20.080] here, but just to say that we recognize that they're there. Oh, this is some of those, this is [16:20.080 --> 16:28.620] another risk of some sort, right? Uh, oh, that's not my brother. Or, oh, this guy, uh, you know, [16:28.620 --> 16:31.480] and what, what, how many, what's, where did these come from? [16:31.960 --> 16:37.260] Sorry, this is from the 23andMe forums. This is just from one month alone. People saying, wow, I [16:37.260 --> 16:41.660] have a half sister I didn't know about. That's not my dad. And I thought it was. I think you have... [16:41.660 --> 16:47.480] Yeah, yeah. So I have a friend who's a woman, she's, uh, in her seventies. Um, and she went and [16:47.480 --> 16:54.600] had, uh, this done with ancestry and turns out her father was not her father. And I thought to [16:54.600 --> 17:01.320] myself, that's a fantastic, that's an incredible thing to learn after, at, at 70. I mean, that's [17:01.320 --> 17:07.400] 70 years of this is who I am and now that's not who I was. That's crazy. And, you know, both of [17:07.400 --> 17:12.900] her parents have passed away and her, her father, who she never knew was her father, has also [17:12.900 --> 17:17.660] passed away. So there's no, like, there's not much to do there, but man, what a, what a [17:17.660 --> 17:23.860] fantastic and crazy thing to have happened. So, uh, we'll just leave you with some resources. [17:23.860 --> 17:29.900] And there are several, um, places that you can take that data and do more with that data. Um, [17:29.900 --> 17:34.460] Live Wellow is an interesting one. That's the one with, oh, NutriHacker. No, NutriHacker is the [17:34.460 --> 17:39.900] one that, uh, wait, which one is Live Wellow? The one that like will guide you through NutriHacker [17:40.400 --> 17:45.940] will guide you through, uh, based on your, uh, genetic data will guide you through like life [17:45.940 --> 17:53.160] decisions and, and, uh, uh, yeah, food, food choices and drug choices and those kinds of things [17:53.160 --> 18:00.300] and give you some guidance based purely on your, on your DNA, which, you know, keep in mind [18:00.300 --> 18:06.480] that's, that's basing a lot on maybe a little, so, you know, use some, use some common sense. Oh, [18:06.480 --> 18:13.480] and then there's even some more deep stuff here. It's a little deeper. Yeah, so the, the [18:13.480 --> 18:18.280] previous slide would show you how to, to get some pretty reports and really look at things from a [18:18.280 --> 18:24.740] higher level, easy to read. Um, this is if you want to dig deeper, you can do so much with this [18:24.740 --> 18:29.880] set of resources and this is not comprehensive by any means, but this can allow you to really dig [18:29.880 --> 18:34.560] into the exact research that, um, that is involved with each of the SNPs or in each of your [18:34.560 --> 18:41.620] variations. You can spend months just looking at probably one variation in your genome. Um, but [18:41.620 --> 18:46.840] this is a really good place to start. Again, not comprehensive, but, um, I encourage you guys to [18:46.840 --> 18:54.540] go out and, and learn about yourself. Yeah. So I don't know that we're the type that we can answer [18:54.540 --> 19:10.730] any questions, but there isn't. Thank you. Yes. I'm just curious what the process is for these [19:10.730 --> 19:17.950] companies. Um, what, what sort of, uh, generic material do you send them for testing and is it [19:17.950 --> 19:24.650] possible to do it anonymously? Oh, anonymously is a good question. Oh, she, she must know [19:24.650 --> 19:30.430] something. Yeah. So most of them are, are, are basically a spit culture of some sort and they [19:30.430 --> 19:34.770] send you all this stuff. They make it super easy and you got to generate some level and you got to [19:34.770 --> 19:39.730] spin into the same. I think it, you know, it feels like a court of spit, but it's really, uh, not [19:39.730 --> 19:45.570] that much. What were we going to say about the anonymous? Oh yeah. So when I went into this [19:45.570 --> 19:51.290] being a, you know, cyber security professional, I have concerns about my privacy tied to my, my [19:51.290 --> 19:58.270] genetic DNA. Uh, I registered as anonymous, but one of the risks is how anonymous is [19:58.270 --> 20:02.950] anonymous. And not only that, but to get the rich information, how much do you have to disclose [20:02.950 --> 20:10.030] that you're, you're avoiding that anonymity? But there are ways to do it anonymously. Um, you [20:10.030 --> 20:15.810] could just build your own lab. I'm sure we're not that far away from that. I'm hoping. Uh, it is [20:15.810 --> 20:59.180] quite expensive now, but everything gets cheaper and cheaper. So, um, yeah. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. [20:59.180 --> 21:06.400] That does sound like a talk. If you do that talk, I want to be there for that. Yeah. Um, I want to [21:06.400 --> 21:12.800] know how, uh, how prevalent are SNPs, single nucleotide polymorphisms, and also, uh, how much, [21:12.800 --> 21:16.520] uh, almost like what's the breadth, how much research is done on each variation, each [21:16.520 --> 21:22.140] occurrence, and what's the odds of what you have actually being something significant? To answer [21:22.140 --> 21:28.400] that, I want to go with how companies like 23andMe, um, sequence your, your genetic code. They [21:28.400 --> 21:33.440] don't take, they don't see everything about you. There are certain common variations that they [21:33.440 --> 21:41.760] test for, and they, they compare it to your DNA. And what, that's where the SNPs come in. So, [21:42.500 --> 21:47.300] they're common. Uh, they're very common. Whether they're expressed or turned on or off is, is [21:47.300 --> 21:53.180] another, uh, debate, but they're very common. Um, in fact, the, the, what I said, I have the [21:53.180 --> 21:59.200] MTHFR homozygous C677D. Uh, about a third of you probably are the same. It's, it's pretty [21:59.200 --> 22:05.120] common. Yeah, and I'll, and I'll say some of them are, you know, saying you have a mutation or a [22:05.120 --> 22:09.500] variant, sometimes, you know, that can sound like something. Not only is there the issue of [22:09.500 --> 22:12.960] expression and epigenetics, but there's also just the fact that sometimes it's just for [22:12.960 --> 22:19.560] something goofy. Like, I can smell, uh, uh, asparagus in people's pee. So, uh, you know, it's, [22:19.560 --> 22:25.740] it's nothing, nothing to be, like, to fret over necessarily. Veritas Genetics will do your entire, [22:25.740 --> 22:32.300] uh, genome now for a thousand U.S. It's coming down. Are you thinking of doing that? Ooh. I am. [22:32.300 --> 22:39.950] Yeah? Definitely. Plus, plus they're doing a lot. That's another interesting thing about these [22:39.950 --> 22:44.890] companies too. Now they have this amazing data set, right? Um, and they're, they're now doing [22:45.670 --> 22:49.790] correlations where they would have never known there was a correlation before. And it's, and [22:49.790 --> 22:53.630] it's, and it's good. And some of it's goofy, but the, but the, the proof of concept is there and [22:53.630 --> 22:57.270] they're fine. And they're, they're starting to get to the point where they can say based on [22:57.890 --> 23:04.190] previous data that we've seen, we know that you have a 80% chance of, you know, something goofy, [23:04.190 --> 23:10.950] cleft chin or something. Last question. Um, so great talk. Thanks very much for sharing your [23:10.950 --> 23:15.770] personal stories. And one of the challenges of genetics is even if you do all of that, [23:15.770 --> 23:21.810] you'll potentially not anonymous because we can find you. It's maybe five to 10 other factors [23:21.810 --> 23:28.510] and we'll identify you. So the law currently says from a medical standpoint in this country, [23:28.510 --> 23:37.210] you cannot be prevented from accessing preexisting condition. The challenge is that that's not true [23:37.210 --> 23:45.050] from insurance and you can be declined insurance as a result of it, which makes what you've done [23:45.050 --> 23:52.190] essentially a risk. Absolutely. Um, I've been fully sequenced. I've had a full genome sequence. [23:52.190 --> 23:58.030] I've had 23 and me, um, as part of an exploration. And one of the challenges I find with that is [23:58.030 --> 24:03.990] that there's a real disconnect with the data and the reality of exploring it. Certainly when it got [24:03.990 --> 24:10.210] faxed to my general practitioner as a printed report, which was just preposterous to me. Um, [24:10.210 --> 24:17.010] I, I'm just curious to know what you think about the impact that that's had on you or has it, [24:17.010 --> 24:22.170] has that changed anything from your world in terms of... So I haven't, I haven't experienced [24:22.170 --> 24:27.070] any explicit impact, uh, related to like, uh, insurance coverage and any of those kinds of [24:27.070 --> 24:30.650] things. But that's an interesting question, right? That's one of the risks that we may have. It's [24:30.650 --> 24:33.870] one of the things I don't know that we've solved. I think some people think it's solved. I don't [24:33.870 --> 24:41.810] think it's really solved for sure. I, I'm one of the guys, um, that is more willing to be, I'm more [24:41.810 --> 24:48.730] willing to give up more of my privacy to get more stuff out of, out of life. Um, I know that's [24:48.730 --> 24:56.410] contrary to this, this whole crowd, but I'm, I'm, I'm kind of like, I'm kind of like Joe U.S. I'm, [24:56.410 --> 24:58.450] I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm a guy that's gonna tell me some stuff and, and let's see what happens. [24:59.290 --> 25:03.490] Security through obscurity, right? Um, and I think a lot of people are that way, but, and I [25:03.490 --> 25:08.610] think that at the end of the day, there's some serious risk there. I, I don't know if that [25:08.610 --> 25:11.050] answered your question. I haven't run into anything. [25:11.050 --> 25:16.850] I think that's a fair comment. And ultimately, I think we all give up our privacy at the point [25:16.850 --> 25:22.370] that we have a catastrophic illness or a condition because at that point, who cares? I need all [25:22.910 --> 25:28.430] So, I think it's not an unreasonable, and I don't want anybody to stab me in this circumstance. [25:28.430 --> 25:33.270] But at some point, you've got to give up something to get all of that. [25:33.790 --> 25:35.610] And, you know, it's finding the balance. [25:35.750 --> 25:37.250] Agreed. Nice. [25:37.330 --> 25:39.450] Okay, I think that's it, folks. Thank you guys very much.