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11220	12220	Go ahead.
13320	20820	All right. Hi, everybody. Wow, I can't believe I'm getting to speak to so many of you at once.
20820	26960	This is really exciting. If you didn't know, my name is Caitlin Bowden. I am the CEO and founder
26960	33040	of BADASS, which stands for Battling Against Demeaning and Abusive Selfish Sharing. I'm going
33040	37680	to be doing a brief intro real quick of who we are, what we do, and then I'm going to introduce
37680	46560	you to my amazing team. So here we go. Well, BADASS started out originally because I found
46560	52260	out that I myself was a victim and, you know, I saw the scope of the issue, how big it is.
52440	60480	I was a victim of non-consensual pornography or non-consensual intimate images being shared online
61700	66580	when I didn't want them to be. I started researching the websites that were surrounding
66580	72280	this kind of stuff and saw how big the problem was and how there were no resources for this sort
72280	77640	of stuff. I got really sick of feeling helpless, so I started reaching out to other victims.
78040	84820	I kind of wanted to crowdsource justice and, you know, I found all these amazing,
84820	91860	wonderful human beings who were just as just as sick of being as helpless as I was.
92000	96260	And we just got together and started brainstorming different ways we could fight back.
97100	103240	Now, before all this happened, I was a bartender and didn't have any experience in any sort of,
103240	108340	you know, tech field or really much of anything other than making the best Long Island you'll
108340	113900	ever have in your entire life. You know, but I went from being a bartender to, you know,
113900	117980	helping introduce legislation in the state of Ohio that would criminalize revenge porn,
117980	124620	which we did get cast, you know, to organizing, you know, a huge group and helping out thousands
124620	131740	of victims, helping them remove their photos and collect evidence and seizing justice.
132920	138620	You know, and then I got to go and introduce a federal bill, you know, which is still,
138620	144240	you know, going through the process, but hopefully pretty soon it might be a criminal
144240	149860	act in the United States, which is what we'd like to see. You know, and now I get to talk
149860	157280	to you guys. So really, this is like the peak of my career thus far. You know, but why am I
157280	162460	speaking to you? This is DEF CON. You don't want to hear about, you know, legislation right now.
162460	169240	You're supposed to be here talking about hacking and tech. And, you know,
170220	179400	and I'm here kind of because y'all keep insisting on it. Everyone keeps insisting I'm a hacker. I
179400	183960	have helped organize a thousand victims to fight back and we've gotten to do a lot of really cool
183960	191480	stuff. You know, from, you know, posting thousands of pictures of Shrek to drown out threads of nudes
191480	197540	being shared without consent. And, you know, teaching them some tips and tricks on how to be
197540	203920	secure and, you know, still express their sexuality online. You know, and there's other things that
203920	209320	we've done that are best left for Sky Talks. My lawyer is here. She will yell at me. So
209960	217520	got to be quiet on that one. And here we are. I would love to introduce you to this amazing
217520	222760	and wonderful team. I'm actually just going to be moderating this panel. I'm going to be letting
222760	228200	them speak because I get a lot of chances too and it's time for their voices to get heard.
228200	235920	So without further ado, let me introduce you to my badasses. All right. First off, we have Kate
235920	244340	Venable, the aforementioned lawyer. She is our head of legal. She keeps us out of trouble and,
244340	252340	you know, helps victims with their own specific cases. Next, we have Rachel Lamp, who's my COO.
252340	259220	She is amazing and wonderful and has more empathy, I think, than any other human being
259220	265660	I've ever met in my entire life. Coming next, we have Marlee Farlow, who's our CMO. She is creative.
265660	273640	She is fun. She is organized, which is the opposite of me. I'm very disorganized. Next,
273640	281180	we have Allie Barnes, who is our CTO, who explains all the things that, you know, you guys talk about
281180	287180	when I have dumb questions and teaches me a little bit about tech. And then finally,
287180	297180	we have Timmy Doomsday, who is our CISO, however that's said. And he is a blast. He's hilarious
297180	301740	to be around, and he is really focused on making sure that we have all of our security locked on
301740	309320	tight. And I'm going to be asking them some questions, and you can ask them some questions.
310740	313500	Let's get this thing started. Hey!
316100	318660	Hi! What's happening?
320800	326600	So I just did a really brief recap of what we've, you know, done thus far and what we've
326600	332420	accomplished with Badass. But I would love to hear... let's start this out, you know,
332420	336540	on the positive. I want to hear y'all brag and talk about your favorite thing that has happened
336540	341300	thus far with Badass. What is your favorite accomplishment? Let's start with Rachel.
341980	348940	I'd say my favorite accomplishment with Badass is definitely getting that law passed in Ohio.
348940	354340	It absolutely was life-changing. It was so great to be able to take something that would assist so
354340	360140	many victims, because a lot of us, like in the beginning, we were based in Ohio. So being able
360140	367100	to have a course of action for our immediate base was just really life-changing.
368620	377420	Yeah. Kate, I know you've gotten a lot. Yeah, the law was awesome. Never really expected
377420	384640	that to happen. In the same vein of things I never expected to happen was, you know,
384640	391080	my best friend is like, let's start a non-profit. And here we are. I really,
391080	396720	like when I went to law school, never thought ever that this was anything remotely close to
396720	401960	what I would be doing. And it's so cool. And it's so awesome. And it's so much more interesting than
402560	409120	half of what all my friends do. So I really enjoy it. All right, Marley.
410280	416400	So as a team, I'd say like every time we help a victim is just like a huge accomplishment when I
416400	421820	see one of our victims come into our group and let us know that they actually received justice.
422720	425840	Definitely something to rejoice about. And then on a personal level,
426420	431180	my favorite professor from my university asked me to come and teach a course with her
432200	437880	to like hundreds of students about this issue. I did it once and she's asked me to come back
437880	443880	definitely. And I'm just super pumped about that. All right, Allie.
446340	451580	So favorite accomplishment that I've gotten to like be around and witness is definitely
452660	459760	TITS for DEF CON was great to witness. And on a personal level, you know, just getting to,
459760	463780	I think one of my favorite things has been like the cybersecurity awareness month that we did
464280	467220	and stuff like that has been my favorite.
467520	472200	All right. And finally, Timmy, the newest member of this team.
472860	478620	Right. So I'm like the squid, right? So, you know, my biggest accomplishment, honestly,
478620	485880	is to just be here with these wonderful people on this panel today. You know, I started out,
485880	492360	Rachel recruited me as just a, you know, humdrum volunteer working victim intake,
492360	496580	and now I get to sit here with these wonderful people and talk to all you.
499140	504120	All right. So now that we've gone over the past a little bit, let's talk about the present.
504480	509540	I know lately we've been a little bit absent on our social media pages. We've been taking
509540	515360	just a teensy bit of a hiatus, although we are still reachable in case of emergency,
515360	519900	if victims need to reach out. But so where have we been?
523020	530380	Well, I think we all took a break to reflect on pretty much what we wanted badass to be
530380	537760	in the future going forward. And also, we were just really out of spoons. As most of us are
537760	545090	victims of some sort of sexual abuse or image abuse. It really, it takes a toll to continuously
545340	550820	have to, you know, go through and reopen those wounds and assist victims.
551940	553160	Mm-hmm.
554300	555340	We also...
555340	556360	Oh, go on.
556540	562400	Sorry. I was just gonna say, and I think like, we're not, I mean, while we do a lot of remote
562400	569800	stuff, we're not immune from, you know, the effects of quarantine that everybody else is
569800	574380	feeling. Like, we're all still here trying to figure out what in the world it means to work
574380	581780	from home and how we have to change our model. Like, nobody knows what, like, the next day brings
581780	589600	in terms of COVID and all of that. So, I think that went a lot, like, went into our decision to
589600	595500	just, like, take a step back because we're all trying to figure it out along with everybody else.
596520	604760	Yeah. I think a big thing also is that we, you know, we started this and it just blew up.
604760	611040	And we were just learning as fast as we could, you know, the best ways to go about doing things
611040	618100	and to run an organization at this size. I mean, we went from being a group of 10 of us to a global
618100	625840	thing. And, you know, we were just scrambling to catch up, but nothing, we didn't have any,
626540	633100	you know, procedures and things in place that were long-term sustainable. We were just doing
633100	637920	whatever we needed to do in that moment and we needed to organize. We needed to figure
637920	644500	out the best ways to do things. Yeah. And I think, like, because of a lot of us being victims, like,
644500	650920	we just coming into this organization came into it, like, crazy passionate and wanting to take on,
650920	656580	like, anything and everything. So, a lot of us were, like, I'm in marketing, but then I'm going
656580	662180	out and trying to do law enforcement training and I'm doing classes at colleges and, like,
662180	667040	taking on so much because I want to and I'm excited to help and move this forward.
667680	674060	And then, of course, you know, burnout comes into play and we have to look at ourselves as an
674060	679860	organization and look at what we want to do, what we want to focus on and do well and then expand
679860	686380	from there. So, exactly. And you mentioned law enforcement training. So, let's talk a little bit
686380	693740	about the laws and responses from law enforcement. Just quick thumbs up or thumbs down from the team
693740	700820	here. Do you think that law enforcement is doing an excellent job of handling reports
700820	707060	and complaints about when it comes to non-consensual image abuse? What do we think?
707860	714260	All right. So, let's talk about that. What do you think can be done to change that?
716420	723760	Training, for one. Yeah, well, like, for me, as a victim, going through my own personal case,
723760	731860	it took nine times to report my own victimization and a lot of the reason was nobody knew that they
731860	737400	handled cybercrimes and that they didn't have cybercrime units and they told me to call the
737400	743480	FBI and it just, like, blew my mind. I'm looking at a statute saying, like, it literally says
743480	749600	number four, local law enforcement handles this issue. So, like, why is there this disconnect
749600	754680	between you understanding that you can do something for victims? And, yeah. So,
754680	758560	I'm just going to say training is one of the biggest issues here.
760900	766380	Okay. Something else that I noticed, and maybe, Kate, you can speak to this a little bit more,
766380	771540	but, like, when I was first brought on, you know, I was working on building resources for victims
771540	776480	and one of that was going through and just making the law a little bit more digestible
776480	784280	and it seems like a lot of the laws that are on the books can't even decide what a nude is and
784280	789320	that seems to be, like, the basis of the entire conversation. So, if we can't even agree on a
789760	794860	vocabulary to talk about these things, how are we going to push effective legislation?
795980	803640	Yeah, I mean, I would definitely agree with that. Like, it's not only just, like, what is a nude,
803640	809800	but I know Marianne Franks has talked about this a lot in a lot of the stuff that she does with
809800	819280	CCRI and, I mean, most of the laws have these intent to harm clauses and basically what it
819280	826960	says, basically you have to prove that the poster intended to harm the victim in whatever way by
826960	831020	posting it and it's next to impossible to prove and it's next to impossible to enforce.
831020	835180	Maliciously, yeah. Yeah, that vocabulary, malicious.
836260	844540	Yeah, it makes it pretty much impossible to enforce at all and I think,
844540	852540	um, yeah, I mean, it just goes on what you said, Timmy, like, we have to agree on something and
852540	858360	then we write these laws and we think they sound all good and great and with an intent to harm
858360	866320	makes it, I wouldn't say useless per se, but it makes it hard. And it even complicates it further
866320	872400	once you get into crossing state lines or country lines because the language of each state law is so
872400	878780	entirely different and, you know, it's hard enough getting police to want to pursue
879360	883420	justice for these victims, but once it crosses state lines, they just give up pretty much
883420	891740	altogether. Yeah, the language has definitely been an issue. Speaking of language, most people know
891740	897340	about the type of abuse that we're fighting against. They know it as revenge porn.
898040	900540	What do you guys think about just that wording?
902660	912740	I'm gonna go. I hate it. Like, I get it. It's like, the media kind of jumped on that term
912740	917960	and sensationalized it, especially with the fappening and things like that happening, but
917960	923220	when you really break it down, revenge porn specifically deals with, like, intimate partners
924540	932360	abusing one another, and it really only represents 8% of non-consensual image abuse cases.
932700	938380	So I don't like it for that reason, but, like, more than that, the term revenge automatically
938380	943700	implies that the victim did something wrong. So there's, like, victim blaming built into it,
943700	949880	and then the term pornography also has a false sense of consent built into it because generally
949880	958420	people who are creating pornography content are consenting to be taped and shared, which none of
958420	964780	these victims are. So personally, I don't like the term. I will use it in cases where I'm trying to
964780	968400	get some awareness out and people aren't understanding what I'm talking about, so more
968400	974400	as a reference point, or if I'm specifically dealing with somebody whose former partner
974400	986200	or current partner is abusing them. Yeah, I like the way that you just dropped that stat out there,
986200	991920	like, it's only 8%. Are there any more stats that you think are really important to share?
992380	999160	Actually, since you are our stats person, you know this stuff better than any of us.
999160	1007560	Stats on stats. Yeah, it's actually kind of interesting because there's not a ton of
1007560	1014720	resources dedicated to researching this topic. Like, CCRI is amazing. They so far have put out
1014720	1021240	the most research on the topic. I did recently see one that came out in February that said
1021240	1027290	that the rate in which this is happening is one in three people are being victimized,
1027290	1034030	and that was just two months ago. But that was geared more towards European countries
1034030	1039810	and wasn't a worldwide view. The most recent stat we have as far as worldwide is concerned
1039810	1046030	is 2017, which said it was one in eight people. And I'm sure we'll get into lots of reasons why
1046030	1053590	that is rising quickly, but it's hard to say. I'm going to go with probably something closer
1053590	1059510	to one in five, one in six as of currently, but it's something that we really need research on.
1059970	1067050	And then I know another interesting fact is that, you know, this affects three out of four women.
1067050	1074930	Victims are women in most cases, or female-identifying people. But in cases where
1074930	1081710	the victim does identify as male, it's 90% of those cases incorporate sex torsion as well
1081710	1093270	as the image abuse. So that's just some facts. And yeah, those are scary, scary figures to hear.
1093550	1100430	Yeah, that many people this is happening to, this is a huge problem. You know, but the biggest thing
1100430	1105370	that we hear when we discuss these sorts of things with the public or in the press,
1105370	1110010	immediately the first thing we hear is, well, this wouldn't be a problem if you just didn't
1110010	1116290	take those pictures. And so we hear it so much. I know we all have a ton of different responses
1116290	1122090	that we go to. So let's share all those responses. Let's just get that out of the way.
1122970	1127690	Rachel, I can see it. You're about to explode with things to say.
1128010	1135570	I have so many words for people who say such things, but I'm going to keep it professional-ish.
1136990	1146050	It is not the victim's fault. Like, it's 2020. We have cell phones attached to us. They're basically
1146050	1152990	part of us. It only makes sense that, you know, people would be using their cell phones in their
1152990	1160270	sex lives as well. I mean, we use it to record when we sleep, like to tell us when we fart,
1160270	1164990	like when we talk in our sleep. Like, of course, it's going to be incorporated into
1164990	1172430	sexual relationships as well. So I think the thought of excluding that or blaming the person
1172430	1176910	because of them using and expressing their sexuality within a consenting
1176910	1181850	form and that being abused, it's just, it's senseless.
1185350	1190710	One thing that bugs me is that people always say that when the fact is we,
1191710	1194950	you don't even need to take a nude to become a victim anymore.
1196090	1200950	You know, I see deepfakes are already being brought up here in the chat,
1200950	1209670	and that is, you know, something we have been monitoring. So what should we do about the
1209670	1220080	deepfakes? Do we see that becoming more of a problem? Yeah, I mean, I feel like the media
1220080	1226360	recently has just realized that that's a thing. But it's something I think our organization has
1226360	1233600	been talking about amongst ourselves and within the community of victims and activists for over
1233880	1239440	a year now, I would say. And then all of a sudden, like within the last, like, I think six months or
1239440	1245360	so, the media is like, oh, deepfakes. And I'm just like, looking at the headlines, like, duh,
1246220	1253180	where have y'all been? But yeah, no, I mean, it's, it doesn't necessarily mean you took a nude or
1253180	1259200	anything anymore. Like, it means some jerk put your face on some random naked person and is now
1259200	1266540	exploiting you on the internet. I believe our first deepfake victim came to us about a year
1266540	1273880	and a half ago. And since then, it's, it's, it's going to continue to rise, like, human
1273880	1278940	curiosity, and then us just being bored and quarantined. People have a lot of free time on
1278940	1288020	their hands. Deepfakes are going to continue to be on the rise. Yeah, I'm actually interested to
1288020	1296380	find out what the stats are on that, just because, like, being quarantined, people are just stuck in
1296380	1301320	their computers. And there's all these apps coming out all the time that allow people to create
1301320	1306880	deepfakes. I know that there's that one, I think, a year ago, or a little less than a year ago, that
1306880	1314360	came out and was kind of making waves. And I really wish I, like, I knew how to how to stop that or
1314360	1321860	any advice to prevent that from happening. But it's just, it's cropping up everywhere. And so
1321860	1327000	quickly that I'm just, I'm not, I'm at a loss, personally, as to what to do.
1327540	1334980	And I mean, it doesn't help that, you know, the, think about the processing power it takes to do
1334980	1341100	some of that stuff. It wasn't just sitting on your desk two or three years ago. Whereas now,
1341100	1346380	I have a laptop that could probably generate a deepfake in an hour or two, you know, with the
1346380	1354020	right settings. And never underestimate, you know, someone that's time rich and money poor,
1354020	1359900	which is a lot of us right now. Yeah, I was gonna say that's exactly it. People have so much more
1359900	1372940	time to write these tools and stuff now. Yeah. But beyond deepfakes, I mean, that's a, it still
1372940	1378300	is a problem that is growing. And it's something we're anticipating. But you know, the majority of
1378300	1384200	the people coming to us, you know, their images that have been leaked, or something that they
1384200	1390700	took, or allowed a trusted partner to take, and that were leaked without their consent.
1391840	1396500	So say someone wants to, you know, still continue doing that, which we encourage,
1396500	1399960	we encourage that sort of thing. But we want them to do it safely.
1400820	1406880	What tips do you have for people to sext and take nudes and not become victims?
1409960	1414900	So there's a few things I feel like that we tell people. And I mean, I feel like this is
1414900	1419060	the perfect time where I love how we do Cybersecurity Awareness Month, because I feel
1419060	1424240	like it's a perfect time to like, flood everyone with all the tips every day. And Rachel did such
1424420	1430360	a good job last year. Yeah, I almost said yesterday, last year, putting stuff together. But
1430360	1436460	you know, basic things are like, simple things, but you know, turning off the location on your
1436460	1442660	phone and making sure your address is not attached to your data that's coming from your camera roll.
1442860	1448640	Pay attention to what apps you're using and what data they're storing of yours.
1449000	1453620	Something that a lot of people don't think of that I've seen people get bit on is like Snapchat
1453620	1459040	memories. You take a picture on Snapchat and you think it goes away, but Snapchat saves it and is
1459040	1464240	like, trying to remind you about it later. But all it takes at that point is someone to get your
1464240	1470420	Snapchat password if you don't have everything protected properly. So those things, you know,
1470420	1478320	things we say, keep two-factor on for all of the things that you can. You know, pay attention to
1478320	1482740	what's in the pictures that you're sending to people that you don't know or trust. Make sure
1482740	1488920	there's maybe no random box in the background with your home address on it. Yeah, those are
1488920	1492580	the things come to mind off the top of my head. Speaking of making sure you know what's in your
1492580	1497860	pictures, exit data. You want to make sure to wipe that so you're not accidentally sharing
1498520	1505220	location and stuff like that. What else? Oh, I was just, sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt. No,
1505220	1510520	no, I was done. Go. No, I was just gonna say like, so in my day job,
1511040	1517640	when I'm lawyering and stuff, this has like actually really helped my practice and me helping
1519200	1526160	victims and, you know, like just raising awareness in general as to like how to protect your own
1526160	1532080	privacy, not just in terms of image abuse, but like if there's domestic violence or stalking
1532080	1539180	or some other, you know, like menacing or whatever crime you can think of that involves
1539180	1547540	somebody being creepy, like it's basic privacy info. Change your passwords, turn on two-factor,
1547540	1553960	turn off your location, don't give your significant other like unfettered access to
1553960	1561540	where you are 24-7 because that's creepy anyway, but that's neither here nor there. But I mean,
1562140	1568380	it's just, I mean, basically what Allie said, like it's stuff that people don't think about
1568380	1577500	and with the way that all these companies like Google and Apple and whoever like track
1577500	1583320	our data these days, it's important to know what data we're sharing and who is seeing it
1583320	1588960	and what control we have over who it goes to and where it goes to and when.
1588960	1597180	And also, sorry, I was going to say to add on to that, you could, you can simply
1598480	1603020	watermark your photos with the name of the person you're sending them to.
1603340	1609860	And also you can, you can create kind of a contract between each other by like asking
1609860	1618180	your partner explicitly like not to send these photos or it will cause me harm. Those are really
1618180	1623840	important words because we know that that's how the laws really frame them is that intent to harm.
1623840	1629240	So if you can just check that box immediately and screenshot it, keep it in a file with their name,
1629240	1633520	then I think that would really do a lot in the way of prevention and also
1633520	1637400	assisting in your own legal case if it comes to that point.
1640430	1644750	Yeah. I always want to remind people, you know, you want to think about the future
1645490	1651870	and always hope for the best, prepare for the worst. You know, make that screen, that contract
1651870	1658730	screenshot at your lawyer. If they ever need one, we'll thank you for that. So yeah, that's really
1658730	1665230	important. I know that we had discussed Snapchat and other various apps that are being used to
1665230	1674190	share these images. And what, you know, responsibility do they have, do you think,
1674190	1678330	to, you know, prevent this sort of thing from happening? And what are you seeing
1679450	1684150	platforms and companies doing that they're just falling short and letting,
1684150	1688270	you know, victims, victimization happen on their platform?
1692740	1694600	I mean, do you want the real answer?
1698520	1706780	I mean, from my perspective, like, Facebook could like respond to subpoenas that are from
1706780	1714320	not law enforcement, maybe, possibly, at some point in time, that might be helpful.
1714700	1720220	Like, if somebody sends stuff during mess, like using Facebook Messenger, it's next to impossible
1720220	1727900	to get anything useful for court. And you're, I'm not law enforcement, so they don't care.
1729820	1734720	I mean, other people can speak to what they've experienced, but that's the first thing that
1734720	1739940	comes to mind for me. Well, the other thing that, the first thing that comes to mind for me are
1739940	1745440	hosting companies, right? There's usually a blanket AUP policy that says,
1745440	1752560	don't post these kinds of things. But image abuse, if there's, especially if there's not
1752560	1759240	minors involved, right, they may or may not be on their abuse priority list. So I think it's
1759240	1763400	important to hold these hosting companies accountable and keep letting them know when
1763400	1771340	they're willingly hosting, you know, websites and clients that are committing image abuse,
1771340	1776000	like Cloudflare. Oh, wait, wait, what did we have planned for Cloudflare when we said that
1776420	1785260	at some point? I just want to throw that out there. Yeah, just, we're waving, we're saying hi.
1787680	1791540	Now, we've run into these issues with Cloudflare for a very long time.
1792880	1798220	They have repeatedly, you know, and it's not just them, but they are the most egregious when it
1798220	1804200	comes to this. What, you know, other apps, let's call them out. Like, who is just doing a really
1804200	1809660	shitty job of letting victim, of letting victimization happen on their platform? And
1809660	1813520	versus who do you think is doing all right? Like, who's actually trying?
1814080	1820920	I think that Twitter is quite a shame. They could really respond to reports. I remember that there
1820920	1830860	was an actual Twitter account that was for one of these hosting sites. And it took two years for it
1830860	1837310	to be removed. And they openly boasted about having specifically leaked images and revenge porn.
1838100	1840190	So, Twitter.
1844080	1845140	Anyone else?
1845140	1851560	Twitter. I can speak to a couple of ones that have at least been trying. And mind you, their
1851560	1857140	methods aren't perfect. And obviously, victimization still happens quite a bit on their
1857140	1862200	platform. But at least they are a either trying to address the problem or prevent it. You know,
1862200	1868740	Facebook, they came out with a pilot to try to prevent images from being uploaded in the first
1868740	1873920	place. And yes, it's Facebook, and nobody's going to trust them. As I believe the press, you know,
1873920	1880100	kind of twisted it to, you know, send Facebook your nudes, which is the worst idea ever. But
1880100	1885540	they were trying, they addressed that there was an issue. And, you know, they acknowledged it,
1885540	1890840	and they are trying something. And the other one that has been actually good to work with,
1890840	1894560	and I know this is, you know, a bit of a controversial opinion, but Pornhub has
1895800	1902340	had their moderators involved with us from the very beginning, and given us a direct line to
1902340	1908100	making sure that things get taken down really quickly, as soon as, you know, anyone discovers
1908100	1912560	there's a problem. And no one has even, you know, really tried to make sure the problem never
1912560	1917100	happens in the first place yet. But I'm waiting to see that happen next. And I'm really excited
1917100	1925380	about that. Anyone else? Want to call someone out? Want to call a platform? Start a fight? Let's do
1925380	1936940	it. I mean, we've had issues with Instagram forever. Like, reporting. I mean, I personally
1936940	1946080	know someone who, it's not necessarily, like, revenge porn or image abuse per se, but it started,
1946080	1954840	like, his victimization started with Instagram. And it's been years. And it's taken thousands of
1954840	1964620	people reporting, and millions of dollars extorted for them to even do anything. They finally, like,
1964620	1971800	CNN got the story recently. But other than that, like, I mean, it's insane. Like, everybody I know
1971800	1980780	who has been victimized on Instagram has had the worst time even getting them to listen.
1981980	1988100	Yeah, and that's a shame because I feel like a lot of, like, high school leaps end up on Instagram.
1988100	1993680	And the fact that they're not very responsive in a very fast way, really, it's a shame because
1993680	1997980	that stuff should be snuffed out relatively quickly, you know.
1999100	2015580	I have one. Reddit. So, like, they try sometimes. My qualm with them is that they don't,
2015580	2022920	they have moderators who do remove content, which is great, but they don't retain that content so
2022920	2030320	that victims can claim it and use it as evidence, which is kind of a huge problem. Like, and where,
2030320	2037160	I'm in Florida, and it's a stackable offense here. In my case, my image was posted on Reddit and also
2037160	2044660	on another site. And the person who did it was only facing a misdemeanor because Reddit took
2044660	2050280	down the image, and I had no proof that it was ever there. So, you know, I reached out to them
2050280	2055000	directly and asked them, like, what's going on? Can you put something in place? If you can flag
2055000	2060780	images as non-consensual image abuse, then you should also be able to, like, keep them in a
2060780	2070660	repository that's saved for law enforcement to contact and get later. But alas, there's nothing.
2070660	2072860	Absolutely. And how could we forget Discord?
2072860	2073990	Discord.
2077180	2083800	That's actually the first time I ever came to Discord was because of my images being in
2083800	2091500	an entire revenge porn Discord server, which is lovely. And they also remove content without
2091500	2097700	preserving any of the data. You just have to really hope that the officer you're working with
2097700	2103620	is able to send the preservation of data quick enough before that content is just gone forever.
2104560	2107740	Smash cut to the stream getting dropped immediately.
2107740	2114640	I mean, and that's not even in just, you know, image abuse cases with adults. We've run into
2114640	2122240	that issue as well. A lot of our work, you know, does involve CSAM, which is exploitation of
2122240	2129640	children. And so it's been really frustrating to see companies drop the ball on that a lot.
2132080	2137200	So we've discussed, you know, the platforms and their responsibility. And I know a little
2137200	2142240	bit ago, I just saw a really great talk, actually, you know, just a couple hours ago,
2142240	2147900	it was in Crypto Village, and it was regarding Section 230, as well as the upcoming, you know,
2147900	2155440	Earn It Act, which is gaining momentum, you know, through the process. And, you know,
2155440	2166140	what are your thoughts on those? Yeah, I mean, with CDA 230, it has a lot of nuance
2167380	2175500	to it. It has some good points. And it also has, it also creates loopholes that I don't know,
2175500	2179500	I don't want to like criticize it too much, because I'm not sure that the loopholes were
2179500	2185920	necessarily intentional. But I mean, when we were talking about Cloudflare earlier,
2185920	2192820	I mean, their web hosts aren't responsible for the content that they're hosting because of laws
2192820	2201780	like CDA 230. And while they are meant to be helpful, like they also create more problems.
2201780	2210560	And I just, it needs to be retooled so that it's a better law and has less room for wiggle,
2210560	2216400	like less wiggle room. You know, the biggest argument that I've really heard when it comes to
2216400	2222120	that, you know, and a lot of what our work is, whenever we're trying to talk about legislation
2222120	2228400	regarding this form of abuse, the biggest argument I hear about is about how, you know,
2228400	2237300	NCP is, it's a free speech thing. And people claim that, you know, this is free speech.
2237300	2242330	And what are your thoughts on that? Well,
2247420	2256380	I think that nudity and nude photographs could be free speech, but once it enters into the realm
2256380	2263800	of harming people, that's when it exits, you know, free speech up until a point.
2264060	2271100	But what, at what point do we consider things to be harmful? I think it comes down to the consent,
2271100	2278860	personally. Yeah, I'd agree with that. I think that's where the, I think that's part of the
2278860	2287260	argument behind the intent to harm thing, intent to harm clause, is that's what makes it not free
2287260	2294800	speech anymore. But we can't define it that broadly and make it that vague because it becomes
2294800	2301700	unenforceable. Free speech is complicated. It's way more complicated than the average person would
2301700	2308780	think it is. And yes, we have free speech, but it doesn't mean that you can say what you want
2308780	2315960	and do what you want without repercussions. And it doesn't mean that, it also doesn't mean that
2315960	2321520	just because it's free speech, it's the right or moral thing to do. Like, there's a difference
2321520	2327680	between what our country allows us to say and what is morally and ethically correct.
2329120	2339280	Yeah, legality doesn't always equal morality, nor vice versa. Yep. So yeah, I know this,
2339280	2346700	I've seen quite a few questions in the chat. Also, big props to my amazing husband, TC,
2346700	2351720	if you haven't noticed, he has been helping us field these questions. He's making sure that we
2351720	2357860	get them. And any messages that I might be missing, because I'm also moderating the panel
2357860	2363040	and don't always have time to look at this chat, he's making sure we see them. And just basically
2363040	2373020	being the most amazing personal assistant in the world. So thank you, TC. So I would like to start
2373020	2379800	addressing some audience questions. All right, and the first one is, given the type of victims
2379800	2384580	that you help, do you find that you as an organization are now targeted in order to gain
2384580	2390900	access to lists of clients by harassers and such like? And they aimed that toward Ali.
2392200	2401740	So I mean, let's start that off with you. Yeah. So I would say it definitely, you know,
2401740	2407640	makes us more at risk. I don't know if I would say that it's for people wanting to get a list
2407640	2414320	of our victims or clients, people that we help so much as it's people that are pissed off that
2414320	2420520	we're doing what we're doing. And they kind of, you know, feel this need to, like, plot a revenge
2420520	2429460	against us kind of thing. We're taking away their control, right? So they're revenging revenge porn.
2430320	2437600	Revenge. I mean, I think Caitlin can tell you this. We have a whole lot of trolls.
2440200	2445720	And yeah. Can we talk real quick, though? Like, speaking of trolls, can we just talk real quick
2445720	2451600	about tits for DEF CON from last year? And how that went? If anyone remembers that.
2452160	2458160	And I remember. Yeah, that was fun. People were mad.
2460060	2467640	But yeah, I mean, we've gotten, like, I mean, yeah, we've gotten trolls.
2467640	2473900	We've gotten, it's not just trolls. You can only use, you can only use money you've made in InfoSec
2473900	2479780	to come to DEF CON. That's the only money you're allowed to use. Yeah, whore money should be spent
2479780	2486580	on poor things. Exactly. Just what we did. Right?
2486700	2504240	I like that. Yeah. And we've had, like, members of the org be, you know, threatened,
2504240	2511980	re-victimized, doxxed, like, all kinds of things. So I'd say, yeah, 100%. People do target us.
2512060	2520000	They try to. And, you know, we all support one another. And do our best to fight against that,
2520000	2526860	too. I just wanted to show off the whore dollars, the stickers that we had for DEF CON last year.
2526860	2533440	That says, I spent my whore money at DEF CON. And she's got a titty out. Her favorite one.
2533440	2539780	Just one. I think I have three whore dollars. Three whore dollars? What are you going to buy?
2539780	2546940	What whore things are you going to buy? Something special. I don't know where it came from.
2547620	2551980	I don't know. All right. So the next question. All right. So we discussed,
2551980	2556840	you know, do we see ourselves more of a target? I think so. We have had people try to infiltrate
2556840	2562700	our, you know, private spaces that we have for victims. We have a lot of different things that
2562700	2568880	we do to make sure that when people contact us, they are who they say they are. You know,
2568880	2575740	because there have been some, you know, threats made of people trying to gain access to victims
2575740	2580480	or, you know, looking to, you know, there's a whole separate there's a whole separate
2581680	2586820	fetish for people that enjoy seeing victims reactions when they find out their photos are
2586820	2590900	out there. They like to get the screenshots of them notifying victims, hey, your pictures
2590900	2595880	are out there and they freak out. You know, and I had somebody tried to do that to me,
2595880	2601380	actually, on Twitter rather recently. And I just made fun of them. It was great,
2601380	2608500	because I no longer give a shit. But that is a thing. So gaining access to victims and watching
2608500	2614680	them in their most vulnerable states, you know, that's the how awful is it that people get off
2614680	2622220	that? Just saying. Next question is, what are some privacy tips that parents can pass on to
2622220	2628760	their kids or teens? You know, recognition of exploitative behavior, protecting oneself online
2628760	2635580	from malicious X, so on and so forth. I'm going to like repeat what we said a little bit earlier.
2635580	2641080	And just like, in general, have a talk about consent with your kids and your teens,
2641080	2645820	even starting at a really, really young age, like consent applies to everything. It's never
2645820	2654360	not sexy. And it's never weird to bring up that, like, I want you to do this or that with my body
2654360	2662260	or images of my body, and only that. So yeah, just impress upon them the importance of consent
2662260	2667640	and having those conversations with their partners. So if they are sharing images, which
2667640	2672320	it probably will be, they do need to have those conversations about what
2672320	2675840	is allowed to happen with those images that they do share.
2676620	2684480	Yeah. Oh, sorry. No, go on. You were clapping. I was gonna say, do not force your kids to hug
2684480	2691160	people. That, I can't agree more. You can start talking about consent at a very early age.
2691160	2695820	And it's not just consent that you want to cover. You also want to cover what your agency is.
2695820	2701140	Having agency over your own body, how to say no, how to speak out when something is making you
2701140	2704760	uncomfortable. These are conversations that people don't want to have because they're
2704760	2711000	uncomfortable, but they need to. Because having them later after a victimizing incident or after
2711000	2716920	trauma is going to be way more awkward, I promise. Not to mention traumatic.
2718500	2722760	No, and I'm just going to pop in real fast too, like, because you're right,
2722760	2726800	consent and agency go hand in hand. And actually just kind of recently,
2726800	2731020	in the last couple of years, there's a new kind of method of looking at consent
2731020	2737240	called the triangle of consent. I encourage everybody to look it up. But that incorporates
2737240	2743880	power, agency, and communication, and all three of those things come together to create consent.
2743880	2748160	So I think that's a really good starting point for talking to your kids and teens.
2749000	2756440	I also think that a really important addition to that is once your kids reach the teen years and
2756440	2762060	you notice that they start to look at pornography, I think that talking about consensual pornography
2762060	2767120	and what that looks like and what they should be recognizing and what they should be consuming,
2767120	2773820	I think that's really important as well. Yeah, I think that, yeah, having just healthy
2773820	2780080	talks surrounding sex is really important, but it's also really important to talk to them about,
2780080	2783520	you know, security and things like that, because they, you know, that is,
2783520	2790040	this is a really big place of where both things, you know, intersect. Because...
2791980	2798600	I was gonna say, I agree with that. Like, you know, I mean, if your child isn't comfortable
2798600	2803280	doing something with their boyfriend or their girlfriend, they should be able to say,
2803280	2809700	yo, I'm not comfortable with this. Like, teaching your kids the way to stand up for themselves
2809700	2816420	will go a long way. And, I mean, I know it's not necessarily, like, image abuse related,
2816420	2825020	but, I mean, it really is, like, all about teaching consent. And recognizing threats.
2825520	2831480	And, like, teaching, just teaching kids to be careful when they're online and talking to people,
2831480	2836260	when they're on TikTok and interacting with people that they think are one person,
2836260	2840980	but they might be somebody else. Like, don't put your private information or your personal
2840980	2847260	information anywhere. Just general abstract, I think, is really important to start that
2847260	2851700	conversation as soon as your kids have access to a device.
2852580	2862520	Mm-hmm. All right, next question, and I was told to ask this one next, is Jordan White wanted
2862520	2866380	to know, they have a famous friend named, you know, I'm going to redact the name because
2866380	2870920	the Streisand effect was real, and she has a very bad stalker who has now been stalking
2870920	2875100	my other friends who have worked for her, provided outfits, business, etc. Should she
2875100	2878720	contact Badass for this or something? She and her friends are very lost.
2880100	2887340	Um, how would you address that? Yeah, contact us. Yeah, definitely.
2888160	2890420	Kimmy, you're the one that said we need to take this question.
2890440	2894820	Absolutely. I mean, I think, I think if there's like that public cry for help,
2894820	2898060	I definitely think that that's something you should contact us with.
2899080	2901640	And that's the whole reason we have this org.
2902760	2910680	Absolutely. I do want to mention that you're, um, that while we do focus squarely on image
2910680	2915600	abuse, okay, which is non-consensual leaking of nude images, it also has to do with upskirting
2915600	2921940	any sort of non-consensual behavior online or offline that involves images. Um, you know,
2921940	2928940	we get approached a lot when it comes to questions about stalking, about, um, harassment, about,
2928940	2934200	you know, abuse. And while we might not have every answer,
2934200	2940100	um, we do know a lot of people that we can talk to, um, and we will always do our best
2940100	2946860	to address these issues as much as we can. Um, so yeah, yeah, absolutely.
2946860	2951380	I think the best way to sum it up, and I actually think Caitlin's the one that said that,
2951380	2956400	said this to me when I first started, was if you think you need to contact badass,
2956400	2960300	if that's even a question in your mind, reach out.
2961780	2966620	Yeah, I mean, even if we can't necessarily, like, even if you don't think that it
2967480	2976280	pertains to what we do, odds are somebody in this group will be able to help you. Um,
2976280	2984440	somebody has experienced what you experienced. Somebody is, somebody's there. Um, that's the
2984440	2991080	beauty of our group, is you're not alone, and you always have somebody to talk to.
2991320	2996600	I will say that when this happens to you online, especially, you know, when it happens to you
2996600	3002620	in my situation, I didn't understand the internet at all. I, uh, barely went outside Google and
3002620	3010060	Facebook. And so when it happened to me, I felt really, really helpless and overwhelmed and alone.
3010060	3016000	Above all, I felt isolated and scared because I didn't know who was doing this to me. I didn't
3016000	3020260	know who had been helping them, who all these people making these horrible comments about my
3020260	3024840	body. I didn't know who they were. So when I turned to somebody for help, it might be one
3024840	3031340	of those people that's just looking to make fun of me more, um, or kick me when I'm down, when
3031340	3037140	I'm feeling vulnerable. So I, you know, just knowing that you're not alone and that there
3037140	3041620	is someone that you can talk to that you can trust and who isn't going to be judging you and
3041620	3047740	isn't going to be re-victimizing you is important. And that can make a huge difference.
3049400	3056760	So yeah, uh, that is absolutely have them, um, contact us. They can do so with any of our Twitter
3056760	3063560	handles. Um, and we'll put those in the chat and, you know, or through our website, www.badassarmy.org,
3063560	3069980	which also I saw one of the questions was, how can people support you guys? And, um,
3069980	3074780	how can people support y'all? And, uh, the best way they can do that is through
3074780	3081600	our website. We have some donation, uh, links that they can use as well as just
3081600	3089980	letting people know we're here. Um, so next question, uh, what about cases outside of the
3089980	3103430	U S like Ireland or the UK? Um, we have a UK group. Um, we know people, um, I mean,
3103430	3111150	our organization has contacts like internationally for, I mean, we can,
3112290	3120630	we can find someone who can help you pretty much is what my answer to that would be. Um, our,
3120630	3131710	our net is wide and we can, um, we all know enough people who know people who can point you
3131710	3141510	where you need to go. I just want to mention that the U S is really far behind everybody else.
3142070	3148590	That's what I was going to say. The UK, they have a bunch of orgs, their laws are built stronger.
3148770	3154570	Um, and Australia, oh my gosh, Australia is just really ahead of this. They have an entire
3155130	3160410	section of their government that is just, um, you know, it's a government funded organization
3160410	3167070	to prevent this. Uh, and they're already tackling things that the U S is still,
3167070	3172070	you know, most people don't acknowledge that they're things that exist like deep fakes or,
3172070	3178070	you know, how this all, you know, they're really starting to make things happen in Australia. So
3178510	3183190	yeah, we have a lot of, we have a lot of ways to go.
3187270	3189810	That's literally what I was going to say. So yay.
3192670	3197310	All right. Um, somebody said it really comes down to this. How can a law or set of laws be
3197310	3202150	created or phrased to fight this issue without being used to clamp down on speech or sex workers,
3202150	3208890	similar to FOSTA-SESTA, which is, um, you know, something that by all means, it was meant to help
3208890	3215810	people that are getting victimized and, um, you know, help prevent this sort of victimization by,
3215810	3221190	you know, in making platforms, um, accountable, but at the same time,
3221190	3226530	it hasn't really been used for that. Has it? No. What it's been used for is to attack and harm sex
3226530	3234870	workers. Um, and it has a body count at this point. So how do you think that we should, um,
3234870	3241990	be addressing this in a way that isn't going to either, A, be used to harm sex workers or, um,
3241990	3248830	B, be used to infringe on our free speech? Yeah. Uh, that's really hard. Uh, but like my
3248830	3256230	first initial thought is to just, is to kind of focus that language on like, uh, or I guess focus
3256230	3263190	the law itself on proof of consent. So like you're responsible if you're posting content to
3263190	3270770	prove that the subject and that content has consented to being in it. Like maybe if there's,
3270770	3279840	if that comes into play somewhere that will help a lot. Like requiring websites that allow
3279840	3286660	pornography to get a release from every person that is actively participating on screen?
3287600	3295500	Yeah. I mean, that wouldn't be any different than other websites that posts. I mean,
3295500	3305160	yeah. Like just verify the user. Um, I mean, I think the U.S. speaking of being behind and
3305660	3311820	how other countries deal with it, I think the U.S. over criminalizes that behavior. Um,
3312660	3318640	from my personal opinion on it, not my necessarily like legal opinion on it, but,
3318640	3327600	um, yeah, I think there's a way to write these laws that doesn't make it like that makes
3327600	3336040	consensual sex work legal and doesn't criminalize it and lets people do what people are going to do.
3336040	3342120	Um, I mean, we're a country founded on privacy. Let people do what they want.
3342140	3350420	And also a large portion of our, um, victim base are sex workers because, you know, you want your
3350420	3355800	photos in a consensual way to be released to a certain market in a certain bubble. And once
3355800	3362360	it releases outside of that, it can be just as harmful as for anyone else, you know? So I think
3362360	3370800	that these, um, sorts of laws help and also harm, you know, it's double-ended. Yeah, Rachel,
3370800	3378960	that's a good point too, is, um, I mean, you're, it's just because you're a sex worker doesn't
3378960	3385440	mean that your copyrighted personal work isn't your intellectual property that you get to keep
3385440	3391980	and that you're entitled to. It shouldn't matter. And consent for one doesn't consent to, to,
3391980	3397460	if. Consent for one doesn't translate to consent for many, allowing a certain, I mean, even
3397460	3401760	transactional consent is consent. And that is the thing that matters. And it's just as traumatic
3401760	3406420	to have people that you didn't want to be seeing your images or, you know, often with sex workers,
3406420	3413420	we find them doxxed, um, along with their images. So it's double the trauma right there.
3413420	3417940	And I mean, I think it's the ultimate irony that we're speaking at a hacker conference where we
3417940	3424420	talk about how broken copyright laws are in the DMCA. And at the same time, you know, that's one
3424420	3431480	of our, as an organization, biggest tools to fight some of this, you know, is the copyright laws.
3432140	3437540	Oh yeah. Um, hey, you know, we have a really important question I do want to address. Uh,
3437540	3444040	this is from a friend of mine, Weems. Um, and they asked what should happen is allowing rules
3444040	3450160	that help victims without removing liability protections platforms outside of CSAM and CP.
3450160	3454720	I deeply, deeply concerned about the bills that have been proposed like earn it, which is
3454720	3459580	definitely a pro-censorship law and even more worrying LAED Act, which would outlaw encryption
3459580	3465000	in the US. And I want to know what the panel thinks about this. Um, anyone else want to take
3465000	3473620	that one first or sort of cool. If I jump, you can do it. All right, cool. Um, you know,
3473620	3481140	I kind of started in on this one with, you know, uh, foster SESTA and how, um, these laws they're
3481140	3489540	you one, they're using CSAM as just, you know, a way to kind of put a friendly spin on this law.
3489540	3494280	Like if, you know, your lawmakers aren't passing it, that's because they hate kids. Um, but really
3494280	3501260	when it comes down to it, it's, um, removing the privacy of every user. Uh, and the fact is we've
3501260	3506580	seen them be put in place and we see exactly how little they actually help the things that they're
3506580	3512780	supposed to be, um, preventing. Um, what these laws are going to be doing is destroying censorship
3512780	3517760	and freedom. And I don't think that's right. I hate these laws. They are, I feel like they've
3517760	3525480	been, uh, bought and paid for by, you know, certain, um, you know, very specific lobbies.
3525480	3529400	And I think they're bullshit and we've definitely, everybody needs to get involved. If there's
3529400	3533540	anything that badass has proved, it's that everybody can get involved when it comes to
3533540	3538660	legislation. And if you care about something, you need to start calling and making stuff happen. And
3538660	3545160	you need to call your, um, lawmakers and talk to them about the earn it act and that, you know,
3545160	3550360	encryption isn't really important. It should stay something that we have available.
3551200	3553680	Yeah. I mean, Oh, sorry, Timmy, go ahead.
3553760	3560000	Real quick. I'll take a, I'll take a line out of, uh, uh, talk Corey Doctorow gave at DefCon
3560120	3564040	a couple of years ago about the war on general purpose computing. And something that I think
3564040	3570260	these lawmakers forget is that it is not possible to make a general purpose computer that does
3570260	3576600	everything except the one thing that you don't want it to do. Um, that's just not how computers
3576600	3584800	work. That's not how math works. And that is a nuance that is lost by the old white men writing
3584800	3594700	these laws. Yeah. And, um, that's a really good point. Oh, real quick. We got like a minute. So,
3594700	3599320	Oh, I was just going to say, um, I thought you were telling me to stop. Um, sorry. Yeah. Uh,
3599320	3603060	that's a really good point to me, but also like to go off what Caitlin was saying, like,
3603060	3610680	um, there is a balance between free speech and censorship. And I think, um, if we're going to
3610680	3616400	start doing things like outlawing encryption and censoring material, like we really need to
3616400	3623160	take that into consideration and without boring y'all with Conwell jurisprudence, um, you know,
3623160	3629160	that's, it's not something to be taken lightly. And I think we really need to examine how we do
3629160	3634180	this and what precedent it could set for the future. I think Kate just really wanted to say
3634180	3640460	jurisprudence. I did. Okay. All right. As long as we got that cleared up goal achieved. All right,
3640460	3646140	real quick. Um, we are going to be going into the voice chat. I know I am. Um, cause frankly,
3646140	3653360	y'all can't make me shut up. So yeah. Um, but I really quick, uh, I just want to see if anyone
3653360	3659160	has one final message they'd like to share with the people watching and listening to this at
3659160	3666580	DEF CON today. Anyone final message, Rachel. Um, I'd say, um, everyone, please reach out. If you
3666580	3671260	have a question, comment, concern, we would love to hear you and we would love to, um, integrate
3671260	3682460	you into our, our group of like, you know, sorry, I mean, I cut out the webcam. Um, I really feel
3682460	3687420	that, you know, there's a place for everyone and you do not have to go through image abuse alone.
3687420	3700380	We're here for you. And yeah. Oh, me. Yeah. Okay. I'll keep it quick. Uh,
3700380	3703640	be awesome to one another. Fuck cloud flare. Black lives matter.
3705960	3707620	All right. Allie.
3708780	3714340	Going to echo Timmy's fuck cloud flare comment. Um, thanks for listening to us,
3714340	3718320	reach out to us if y'all need anything. We're always around to answer questions and,
3718320	3723500	um, we definitely are going to keep talking about this stuff. So.
3724980	3732640	Marley. Uh, ditto on what everybody said. And to add to it, um, yeah, let's please keep talking
3732640	3740700	about this, uh, conversation about how we can make laws that don't infringe on, um, speech and,
3740700	3745620	um, encryption, but that will help victims. I think that's a really important conversation to
3745620	3751820	have and your voices are really helpful. Okay. Do you just want us to do this again?
3752300	3760720	No, ditto, uh, black lives matter and consent is key. I'll always get it.
3760720	3766500	I'm gonna end this, uh, whole thing up by saying thank you to everyone out there watching. Thank
3766500	3771740	you to the, you know, everyone organizing DEF CON this year. I know it has been crazy and chaotic
3771740	3778440	and you haven't do a lot of things that is, that are brand new. And I just want to say it's been
3778440	3785240	wonderful thus far. I miss you all. I can't wait to see you in Vegas next year. Um, and meanwhile,
3785240	3791000	uh, you know, life is short, have all the orgasms, consensual, healthy orgasms,
3791000	3797440	or cookies, depending on what you want. Um, and just stay badass. Peace.