One. Hello everyone, I am Plagg. It's a pleasure for me to be here with all of you and all our
panelists. We're gonna introduce you to something that we work quite a bit. I want to actually
acknowledge Miteki for all her hard work and these lines that we're gonna present.
But this is a labor of love that we have, and we're doing this for some reasons you'll see in
a moment. This panel is about introducing the Mita Mentor Program. So let's dive really quick
into that and then we'll explain what we want to do. From there we'll introduce our panelists
and then we'll have a chat about what the program is. So introducing the Mita Mentor Program.
So what are the Mita Mentor Program goals? So one of the primary goals for us is to bring
together mentors and mentees based on shared experiences, interests, and goals. We want to
help mentees develop goals to overcome career challenges, maybe identify technical interests,
and also help them boost their confidence. We want to broaden mentors' perspectives and mentoring
skills. And one of the important things in here is that the mentors are vetted and held to a
high standard. That's a very important thing for us. So another important thing for us when we talk
about mentoring is that there's a distinction between mentoring and tutoring. For us, mentoring
is focused on the guidance and advice, sharing personal experiences. This mentor program is not
intended as a private technical tutoring, although it is possible that in some circumstances it might
feel like it. A good example will be, I want to sharpen my skills on Python, and you might want
to share a piece of the code, which we'll then give you advice on. Maybe over the relationship
of a mentor and mentee, it leads into a bit of the technical tutoring. But primarily, our goal is to
concentrate on the guidance and advice. A good example for this will be, you know, how to learn
about networking instead of explaining TCP versus UDP. So just keeping that in mind is going to be
very important for us that you keep this distinction between mentoring and tutoring.
Now, the Meet a Mentor program has a series of activities that we're going to introduce to you.
One of the primary keys on us is we want to be transparent with everyone. We're going to be
using Discord. We're going to have one-on-one mentoring. So we're doing our best to try to
find matches based on career and technical interests. We'll speak to how that will work.
We're going to have, basically, sessions, which are, you know, 30-minute virtual sessions,
which, when you're matched to a mentor, you can conduct. These sessions will be on Discord,
on our Splatoon Village channel. So you'll find a place where you can go and meet, and then
just have your session with your mentor. In addition, the mentor program is going to have
monthly meetings. So these monthly meetings will be, you know, about an hour to two hours.
We're going to be able to talk about how the program is going. We're going to introduce new
mentors to mentees, and vice versa. We're going to try to gather feedback from you,
you know, what's working, what's not necessarily working. And then one of the other things that
we want to do is there is a need for sharing important information. A lot of individuals
and folks are looking for advice on different things. And one way in which we can provide that
to many of you is to have regular panel discussions on different topics of interest.
If you are an individual that wants to be a mentor, or you don't have the time, but you
have a particular topic which you would like to share, and just share an hour of your time to do
a panel, we would like to hear from you. We're going to have different topics. This is not blue
centric. You know, if you do Red Team and Bug Bounty, we want to hear from you. All the topics
that we're going to try to use to understand what are the needs of our mentees will be funneled from,
you know, the information we collect from the Meet the Mentor program through our interest form.
Now, with that said, it is time for us to dive into the panel. I will want to... this will be
our official first meeting. We want to get you to know all of the core mentors, and I think
this will be a good opportunity to speak about what the core mentor is. We're aiming to be diverse,
as diverse as possible. We will want to include a few more mentors if you, you know, if your
background is, you know, if you're Asian, if you're Black, if you are transgender or gay or
lesbian and you want to be in here, we want to get you, we want to get more perspectives
and different mentors from different backgrounds. So, if you're interested and you're not seeing
currently on the core mentors, your representation, we encourage you to be part of that.
The core mentors role is to basically, you know, set to the high standard, you know,
what the program will be. And, you know, we're dedicating, you know, a set of time extra to
provide this service to all of you. Beyond that, there will be mentors and, you know, there will
be a path to become a core mentor, you know, as we evolve in the program. If you want to contribute
or if you have more questions, hopefully through this panel, we'll address them. And without further
ado, I'm going to stop presenting my screen now. And why don't we just, you know, dive into
getting to know everyone in the panel. So, we're going to do this in the order that I couldn't see
the screen in here. So, let's begin with Muteki. Why don't you introduce yourself?
Yes, my name is Muteki, aka Cassandra, or whichever one you want to use. So, I'm actually an InfoSec
adjacent person who has been attending DEF CON for a couple years. I got into volunteering at
Blue Team Village. And I have a kind of interesting path that I've taken towards being InfoSec
adjacent in that five years ago, I was a part-time help desk and AV support person. I personally don't
recommend AV. Run screaming if you ever have to do AV. But I'm particularly interested in...
so, I do... right now I'm a sysadmin and I do a lot of incident response for Azure and O365
logging authentication. I'm also a part-time grad student because I'm a complete masochist,
apparently. And my areas of interest in that aspect are a lot of programming,
cloud security and architecture, and microservices and serverless platforms.
Awesome, thank you. Thank you for being here with us. Rando?
I have to find the mute. I've been using Discord for months now. Where's the mute button?
Hi, my name is Rando, also known as Danny Akatsuki. I am a career Blue Teamer,
Threat Hunter, been in security for about 10 years now. And I've worked at companies
like Mandiant and GE Capital. Now I'm a Senior Technical Account Manager, which
sounds fancier than it really is, with Gigamon. And yeah, I've been going, I mean, been in with
DEF CON for about five years now. I'm a DEF CON SOC goon, represent, and I run a contest. And
yeah, I'm super active in the community. That's why I really love this stuff. So, hi.
Awesome, thank you. All right, so who's coming next? Rubix?
Hi everyone, Rubix4138 here. My name is Xavier Ash. I've been around for a while,
got about 28 years of experience, done a little bit of everything, worked for consulting shops,
worked for large companies, small companies, done time in government, and did some startups.
Currently, I decided to kind of retire from all the consulting and go back into just doing
security at a financial services firm right now. And so yeah, a lot of experience with
the blue team side in architecture and building out programs,
managed a couple of incident response teams over the years.
And so yeah, I'm looking forward to the program. Thanks a lot.
Awesome. Gene?
Sure. So I started out life as a systems administrator about 10 years ago. I got into
red teaming in big four consulting. About six, seven years ago, I actually switched to Batik
security consulting. It's still on the red side. I'm doing more management stuff now,
but occasionally I'm allowed to hack stuff. And that's about the only happiness I get these days.
That's so awesome. Allie?
Hey everyone. My name is Allie Hanson. I actually stumbled across security a few years ago
and kind of immediately fell in love with it and really became smitten with not only security,
but the people. And I dabbled in security, sort of certifications, also jumped into the world of
social engineering. And I really have a very broad interest base across the sort of disciplines and
areas in security, red, blue, purple, CTI, aerospace, biohacking. I do a lot of volunteering
within all of these different efforts, kind of across the board, including policy as well.
And recently I actually started my own company. So I'm really hoping to help you all out if you're
interested in learning what it takes to start your own small business LLC. And that's about it. Thanks
guys. Awesome. All right. So we get into NoHackMe. Mute buttons are hard. Hey, what's up? I'm Mick,
aka NoHackMe. Fed for a super long time. You name an agency, I probably worked there. Built out some
incident response teams, built out some threat intelligence programs. Most recently I worked at
the White House, ran a threat intelligence team over the 2016 election, CISO for Pete Buttigieg.
And now I am currently a security advisor at Splunk, kind of taking all the experience that
I have and help folks make the trains go. Super jazzed to be here. I think the experience I have,
especially on the Fed side, if you like public sector for some odd reason, I'm your dude. Like
your favorite Fed's favorite ex-Fed. That's a great way to put it. So thank you for being here.
All right. So we're going to go with Moose. Hi everyone. I'm Moose. I also go by Heather.
I'll dox myself and say I'm one of the senior incident responders at CrowdStrike.
I dabble in a bunch of things. I also volunteer as a red teamer for CCDC.
My IT career began in a very strange way. I was a QA tester for the first Droid phone,
the first smartphone. And it was really enough of a hook to where I got to break that multiple times.
And the rest is kind of history. I've done help desk, desktop support, sysadmin, network admin.
Right before I was core security, I was a lead data analyst. And the whole thing kind of just
ties together in wanting to look at all the things and not wanting to be put in a box. So
if you have multifaceted experience or want multifaceted experience and look at the big
picture, I might be your person. But I eat, sleep, and breathe incident response right now.
So, you know, I had to ask what day it was today. But that's me in a nutshell. And I'd
rather refer to myself as a DFIR dumpster diver in most cases than anything else.
That's awesome. By the way, Moza was early on on the incident response panel. So thank you
for being here again as well. All right. So we're going to introduce also a person
that likes to remain kind of hidden on the background. It's a person that I respect quite
a bit. His name is Clay. Hey, thank you, Plug. Yep, Clay. I've been in the field in general for
about 20 something years. I've done a lot of programming and system administration work.
The past eight years or so, I've been able to focus on security.
And that's been a fantastic ride. I've become more active in the community over the past four
or five years or so. I'm one of the organizers of Blue Team Village. And I love googly eyes.
Awesome. You also have another organization. You want to do a little...
Sure. Yeah. Help organize a walker summit as well. And that's more of a... it's still
security related, but we kind of focus more on hardware hacking. And that takes place right
outside the Philly area. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you for that. All right. And
our last core mentor here with us is Scooby. Hey, hi, everybody. I'm Scooby. I've been in
InfoSec for almost 20 years now. I've worked as a security analyst,
then threat hunting team lead, adversary detection team lead. I built some teams.
I moved to a financial institution for almost a year. Didn't really cut it out for me being in that
type of environment. And now it just changed. And I'm a senior manager incident response
for a smaller company in Canada. But we have international offices. So it's pretty much
all around the world. So yeah, in a nutshell, a lot of threat hunting and blue teaming in general.
Love giving talks. I had the pleasure to do so at DerbyCon, Blue Team Village,
NordSec, GoSec, and a few B-sides as well. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you. So as hopefully
all of you have heard, we have a very diverse set of individuals that are part of the core
mentor program. We all have different backgrounds. I'll introduce myself. So I go by Plod.
I do incident response and I lead threat hunting at some Fortune 20 company.
I think if you want to know more about that, I'm in the Paranoids team. I'm in the fire team
within the Paranoids. And I've been volunteering at DefCon for quite some time now.
Different villages and now pretty much living with the Blue Team Village where they have allowed me
to grow and kind of put this seed into this program where we all together are going to bring
this to you. So we're going to jump into some questions. And if you're here
watching the stream or if you have some questions that you want us to give you maybe
some feedback right here live, then feel free to send the questions over. But let's dive
really quick into one of the more important questions. Because all of us are here,
but what made you want to be a mentor? What makes you, and this is directed to no one in particular,
but we want to know, we want everyone to know what you decided to be a mentor and what makes
you qualified to be one if you want to elaborate on that. So I want to see if someone wants to
raise their hand. Scooby, I think that you have the mic. Well, I decided to be a mentor because
some people came to me in real life asking if I would mentor them. I've been trying to be
more active in the community as well, volunteering at the Blue Team Village since its creation three
years ago. So when I saw this meet a mentor thing, I just said, well, if anyone wants to learn
about this, this, this and this, I'll be very happy to spend some time with you. And for me, mentoring
is kind of making friends, is sharing experience. And I think that the mentor learns as more as the
mentee most of the time. So it's really an exchange and it's not meant to be one direction.
Like I'm not feeding anyone things and I'm more expecting exchange and learning as well
from those people, from their experience. It's not because I've been doing these specific
things maybe longer than them, that they don't have anything that they can bring me as well.
Awesome. I saw no hack me, you kind of went, oh, well, Randall, Randall, you're ready to go.
Yeah, I love this. Oh, thank you, sir. I appreciate it, Mr. Faccio. X is a political campaign.
I actually, no hack me is actually part of this answer for me, because he was one of the very
first people that I met when I got my first security gig. He was actually my team lead way
back when, almost like 10 years ago by this point, and kept me in here for better or for worse.
I have had a very unconventional road through InfoSec. I've been with a lot of companies that
have been laying off and things like that. It's been bumpy, but I'm in a really great place now.
So, I always find for people that are like drug addicts and things like that, your best
help is going to be your sponsors who are drug addicts themselves, who have been through that.
So, people that have fell a lot and have experienced that, and they know the way back
out. So, at a certain point, all of these weird things that have happened through my career,
I didn't want them to be for nothing. And I also have absolutely no shame in talking
about fail stories. I don't care. I love them. I love hearing them from other people.
So, when I run across people that are afraid to fail, or don't want to discuss it, or just
think that they're never going to make it, I'm like, I am an object lesson in how complete
failures can actually have some success. And don't be afraid of it and own it. So,
the best way to do that for me and to give back is a mentor type program. So, that's why I do it.
Like, why waste all of that face in the mud time? I'm just feeling sorry for myself. I want to give
back to other people about how to get back up from it. Awesome. I guess, now hack me so that you
want to have some interaction. Yeah. So, Danny and I go way back, obviously. You know, I started
off in the Navy. HHS, CDC, FDA, like a bunch of federal organizations. I'm a SOC goon, represent.
I work with tool. I've been at this for a super long time. I think that the talks that we heard
all day yesterday at Blue Team Village, I'm not any smarter than any person that's talked. I'm
probably a dum-dum, to be honest with you. But I've been at this for a while. And one of the things I'm
really proud of is I think I've been able to enjoy the experiences along the way. And the important
thing is the people that you meet. We all talk about, you know, it's not what you know, it's who
you know. And I know a lot of people. You name an agency, I probably work there. If I don't,
I probably know someone who has. And I think that's a large part of why I wanted to be a
mentor, to make the road easier for the people that are coming next. Like this gray ain't from
stress. I'm old as shit. So I think if I could do anything to make the next generation of security
a little bit better, we're kind of obligated to as security seniors. So when I had the opportunity
talking to Clay, like I jumped at it. Why wouldn't I want to do this? Like if I have all this
information and all this institutional knowledge about the security game and I don't help other
people, I'm kind of the problem. Awesome. Moose? Yeah, kind of along the same lines. So mine's a
very personal story. I was working at a global five for a long time. Well, it felt like a long
time. Because when you're doing IR at a global five, you feel what years of your life draining
away. And I have always struggled with imposter syndrome, no matter where I am in my career.
I'm not saying I still don't struggle with it, because some days I wake up and I just go,
Oh, my God, what was I thinking? But it's, it's a person that helped me during that. And I can go
ahead and say his name, Christopher Witter, who had years of experience on me, that offered
and said, you know, if you just need somebody to ping things against, I'm willing to set up
regular mentor calls with you. And literally, I would tell him about my struggles and my thought
process. And most of our calls were, you know, you're doing everything right. And that's what
I really needed. And it's so funny that that's sometimes what you need. But just having somebody
that might be outside of your normal scope of influence, like talking to you, for me,
that was invaluable. And I just feel a little bit, you know, because that door was open for me
and a hand came down and pulled me up, I should be doing the same thing. And so I really want to
make myself available and keep that door open and that chain going, because none of us is an island.
Awesome, Allie.
Hey, thanks. So I actually have a business background. And I've spent years of my life
trying to figure out so much in that realm. And I really think that everyone here is a big believer
in sending the ladder back down. So as soon as you figure something out, you know, we should
be sharing that with each other and helping each other, especially, you know, as a woman
in this industry, especially as someone who doesn't look like the sort of stereotypical
InfoSec person, I feel very strongly that I want to help people feel welcome and give them the
resources and the knowledge that I have figured out over the years that, you know, we all have.
And so just big believer and absolutely dovetail on everything that everyone said.
Awesome. So, oh, okay, I'm going to take you. Go for it.
You know, what Allie said actually resonated, because, you know, I'm a woman in an InfoSec
adjacent role, but I've been in IT for a while now. And not only that, but I'm also a gay person.
So I've had a unique set of experiences. And I've also worked really hard on my presentation
skills and giving presentations. Because one thing I realized early on is that I would go to, like,
you know, a small conference or talks at work, and there really weren't that many women presenting
or openly LGBTQ plus people. And once I started doing that, like, people came out of the woodworks.
I had a lot of people approach me afterwards and just, like, and, like, ask me how I got to where
I am. And I'm standing there, like, I'm, like, early mid-career. Like, what do you mean? I'm
nowhere yet. But wherever you are is further than someone else has gotten so far. So one of the
people that I kind of mentor casually on the side is a non-binary person. And that's, you know,
they're someone that, like, I'm, you know, I'm just a boring normal lesbian. Like, I don't know
exactly what their experience is like. But I know enough of it, where we have some common ground.
And the way that we interact is just more, it's more personal and more comfortable than it would
be if we didn't have that common ground. And I think that that common ground is important. And
also, just the visibility is important. Awesome. Thank you. Actually, I'm going to make a note in
here. Precisely because of what Muteki said, we were very mindful of trying to find the best
match for you. So as you sign up for a mentor M&T, which if you haven't, go to the Blue Team Village,
meet a mentor, you'll find all the information you need. We could collect some extra information
if you wanted to, you know, just to help you match precisely with someone, you know, maybe you're
gay or lesbian, and you identify much more with Muteki. And so that's an opportunity for you,
we don't need it. And it's completely optional if you wanted to. And it's precisely because
sometimes you feel, you know, much more closer with someone that is from, you know, identifies
the same way as you do, or maybe the same background, skin color, whatever it is. So we
will have an opportunity to kind of help you with that. With that said, I'm getting some questions
from some of the viewers watching the panel. So before I go into those, you know, one of the
interesting questions here to ask is, have any of you ever been mentored by anyone? I think
Lilmus kind of spoke about it, we can kind of continue with that. And then with that question,
you know, did that help you in any way? So that is the question. So, you know,
Lilmus, do you want to kind of continue since you were, you know, alluring to that? And then we move
on to other panelists? Sure. So at the time, and just to say that I've only been mentored by one
person isn't exactly true. So I would say that I've had numerous people reach out and say, if you
need help on something, please come to me. And I've sat down with some great folks who do different
things. So like on the Red Team side, anybody that knows Commander OpSec, phenomenal. All of
the Dallas Hackers Association folks, absolutely phenomenal people to sit down with. And a lot of
us would tag team between each other. It wasn't formal mentorship. But I would still say that
learning from another person was very, very valuable, especially earlier on in my InfoSec
career. But Christopher Witter and I actually sat down and we scheduled and planned because otherwise
I felt like I was getting too shy. And I wouldn't ask questions until I felt like I was drowning.
And so that was one of the things that really stood out to me as a win factor because
every week I would have to think, okay, I have this scheduled call, what are we going to talk about?
And actually coming up with the problems and coming up with the different points that I was
trying to attack it from taught me more those mentorship calls because I would research first
and I'd almost over research to compensate. And so it ended up being a really fun conversation
and almost work stories at some point. So I don't know that that's going to be the
experience for everyone, but I will say that was a very good experience.
Awesome. I think I saw someone else in there. It's Kubi. Do you have your mic
on and off? Okay. Yeah, I think it's on. I think it's on. No real mentor per se or real,
you know, very steady opportunity like that. But since my first time at Black Hat and
DEF CON, I've met many people, a lot of people from the blood down Slack, for example. Remember
at one point I walked out to the SpectorUps booth and all of a sudden half of my Twitter
feed was around me like Sean McAlf, Armjoy talking with Jean-Ti Kiwi. And I was trying
to listen to them. And I think my nose started bleeding because I didn't understand a single
word of what they were talking about. But, you know, being with these guys over and over and
reading everything they talk about, asking questions here and there, I think that I grew
more in the last three years than probably the 10 years before that, just because of the people
that I was talking with and their generosity in general, just to answer all types of questions,
even if probably the question I did ask, they were asked those questions probably 100 times before,
they still took the time to explain things. And, for example, as well, before my first talk,
I ran into Sean McAlf, and I asked him, do you have a few minutes just to review what I'm going
to present? And he did take the time to review my stuff. And it actually really helped me to
refine my deck and make it more, I think, more interesting for people. And it was very little
things that he told me, but I still keep in mind when I do presentation now, to make sure that I
incorporate what he told me. So those little things that come from a lot of people just adds
up. And I think that having all the mentors here is a good thing as well. So people will be able
to talk to a lot of different people, even if they have maybe a mentor that are a little bit
more assigned. I think that it's, for me, I don't mind answering for other people as well and
keeping the dialogue. And if I can help, I will help for sure.
Awesome. Rubiks, I saw that you wanted to say something.
Yeah, I was introduced to mentorship when I got into the startup world. Atlanta's got a pretty
interesting history in security. Internet Security Systems has produced a whole lot of other folks
that have tried to emulate that success. And so, once I got up into that startup world,
everybody was mentoring somebody. That was just kind of part of the job description.
And I thought that this was great. It would have been so great if I had had this earlier in my
career. I had always been the middle of the road security guy, sometimes in management, sometimes
not. I was never the super elite hacker. I never had tools in my name. I was never a Twitter
superstar. But I do have lots of experience. And so, once I started mentoring on the security side,
it was really surprising how much of that resonated with people. And I was able to help
and give back. And so, that was my introduction to mentorship was from the startup world.
Awesome. Thank you for your answers. So, I'm going to add one more question here,
and then we'll move into some of the questions that we're getting from other people.
I think one of the most important questions that we all have dealt somehow, at some point in time,
is, you know, how do you combat imposter syndrome in your own life?
Rando, I see you kind of moving towards the mic.
Oh, he's... yeah. No, no, I'm good. I'm good. All right. All right. All right. Yeah, this is another
one of my favorite, favorite questions, because I actually just kind of figured this out in the
past couple of years or so. And I think I figured it out around Circle City Con I was presenting
there. And of course, I had always beaten myself up of like, why do I keep getting things? And why
do people care? I'm like, I'm really nothing, blah, blah, blah. And then I was sitting around
with a bunch of my friends, people who I really look up to, that have taught me a whole lot.
And they were asking like my advice on some threat hunting thing or like or something else.
And I had kind of this moment of clarity that said, I am surrounded by all of these people
who I look up to, who I still fanboy over. I could be good friends with them for five years,
and I still fanboy a little bit. And I value their opinions so much and their feedback
so much. Who am I to question them if they also value my feedback? Now, this just works for me,
if I'm saying I don't believe in them believing in me, if that makes any sense, right? Like,
if I value their opinion above other things, am I calling them a liar? Am I questioning
their judgment? So, all of a sudden, I'm just like, okay, I'm buying into my, for all intents
and purposes, my own hype now, because they believe in me, so I will out of respect for them.
And God, that has made such a difference. So, every now and again, I feel out of my depth
in something. But instead of getting down on myself, I'm like, cool, I don't know the thing.
I don't know this thing. But please go ahead and teach me and I am that much ready to light somebody
else up who doesn't have that same attitude and makes fun of somebody. So, I've gained confidence
in doing that, in lighting somebody up for not doing it. And also, it makes my life a whole lot
easier if I just believe in what everybody else believes about me. So, anyway, that's my answer
for that. It was like a watershed thing for me.
Gee, I saw that you kind of went off and off on the mic.
Yeah, I kind of jumped the gun there. Sorry.
It's all right.
I think similarly, maybe accepting that I don't know everything, which for me,
I'm a very arrogant person. That was difficult, soul crushing even. But accepting that I don't
know everything and that I want to learn from other people and that they're willing to teach me
and that the things that I do know or think that I know, the opinions that I espouse,
the things that I'm allegedly an expert on, are grounded in experience and research. And the
things that I need to learn will also be grounded in experience and research or things that somebody
else has taught me. That kind of makes me feel good about the things that I know and
being okay with not knowing things and learning too.
Awesome. Ali, I saw that you wanted to say some comments.
Yeah. I just wanted to put out that I think it's important for me to just remember
that everyone has a different background. Everyone has had different experiences
and those are all equally valid and they're all equally valuable. And just trying to remember that
not only for myself, but I encourage other people to remember that as well and to not diminish
their life and their accomplishments. I can't even say. Too much whiskey already. Oops.
But then also, I think too, whenever I start feeling just overwhelmed or too anxious about
my own imposter syndrome, which I have a ton of because I'm not even a technical person and I'm
trying to play in this technical sandbox, I actually try to channel that energy into
learning more and asking more questions. And I kind of just rechannel that energy and that
works for me really well. Awesome. Moose?
So I've struggled with imposter syndrome throughout multiple careers, multiple years.
And while I don't think it really goes away, a really self-reflective takeaway I have was
it's not always been this good for me. I'm in a place now to where I struggle with it less
and I have to give credit where credit is due. I have a very supportive team. I have very,
very supportive leadership and it has made all the difference in the world. And recognizing
that your environment impacts you I think is super important because when I was struggling
with it at the peak of imposter syndrome, I don't think I was bad. Looking back at it,
I go, I really did know what I was doing, but I wasn't doing it with confidence because I wasn't
around the right people. And I've got to say that that for me was one of the biggest takeaways
because it's not like I've necessarily changed very much as a person, but my environment has
changed drastically. And I think that if you can't find the people to support you in that knowledge
where you are at work, so if you're a team of one or two and you don't really have the people
around you that understand what you're doing and can't support you in that way,
having a community that does it really helps as well, which is just another reason that I was so
happy when Plug said, hey, we're doing this mentorship program thing with Blue Team Village.
I was like, yes, absolutely. We'll help out. This is amazing.
So awesome. Thank you. I'll add a little bit of personal note here as one of the mentors that you
will have the option to talk to. My first DevCon was many, many years ago. I was only three hours
in there. There is a panel that I partake on DevCon, and this is when I want to acknowledge
one of the key individuals. He's Voiceacre, Mike Pertuzzi. He runs some stuff in DevCon, and
he met me and we talked, and he actually helped me to kind of embrace the, you know, be part of
DevCon and, you know, get yourself out to volunteer. You'll, you know, do something that, you know,
that will get you out of that shell. And without having to kind of get him to chat with me, I don't
think I will be honestly here. But in that regard, with imposter syndrome, I started going to the
26 candidates in LA meetings, where there is a lot of very cool hackers, and I always felt like, you
know, what could I bring to the table? And yet, going, you know, for many years to DevCon, the two
people that really brought always a lot of value to me is Matrix, NVIDIA, their goons, and some of
you might know them. And they were very, you know, not necessarily mentors, but they allowed me to
see that a lot of my adventure, at least in DevCon, was up to me, and that I needed to, you know,
that I didn't have an accent, and I needed to stop worrying about things and just let be. So, sometimes,
like someone mentioned earlier, we just need a little word of encouragement that will allow us to
see things in a slightly different way. And in my case, by getting those words, I realized that
helped me break out of that imposter syndrome, which we'll get it. But hopefully, through us,
you'll get to hear sometimes those words of empowerment, and hopefully, the same way that
some of us has, you know, influence in our lives, we can do that to you in your life and empower you
to grow. And with that said, let's kind of go into, you know, an interesting question we
received from the viewers, and it says, as a mentor, what would you define as success in this role?
For you, how can I, as a mentee, get you invested and show accountability? I think that was an
excellent question. Who said me?
Rubix? Yeah, I think that one way that we can measure success from our side is,
you know, very early on, we'll establish, you know, what is it that you want to get out of this?
And so that way, it's not a guesswork on understanding, you know, did what we, you know, all the
time that we spent together, was it effective or not? Like, let's put it on the table.
What do you want to get out of this? And that way, we can track that and make sure that as we're
moving along, we check in. Are we doing anything to help you along? Are you realizing, you know, you
have new avenues that you didn't know that you had before? Are you seeing new opportunities? Like,
you know, I think it's up to us to continually check in with our mentees to understand
and make sure that we're being effective, not just in the end, but throughout the entire
relationship. Awesome. Anyone else? Yeah, I mean, yeah, no, no, that's a much better idea. Clay,
go right ahead. He's so quiet. I need to give him one, right? I mean, he needs to speak a
little bit. Put him on the spot. Come on, handsome. I think Xavier, I couldn't say it any better.
Oh, you cop out. You are the worst. I will unmute just to heckle you. Oh, my God. All right. Well,
well, Clay, I will give you my answer. And then you can ask Clay again. He'll be like,
yeah, Randall got it. Mine is, yeah, to echo what he has said, is it's important for the mentors to
check in with the mentee. Now, just as a caveat, just because you're matched with one of us,
it's not always a match. It's being self-aware enough to be like, listen, there's just no vibe
here. And I've had it happen. I think of myself as very personable, and I really want to help.
But sometimes the vibe just isn't there. And that is completely fine. I need honesty
from them. And I also want to see that they are applying their own critical thinking skills to
what I'm telling them. I don't want somebody just to parrot what I've told them. I don't want them
to copy what I've told them, because everybody's experience is different. Like if I get...
Don't parrot what you're telling us. Got it. Yeah. How dare you? I saw what you did there.
You know, and also be honest with me, right? My life outlook is as a straight white male growing
up in suburbia and living in a metro urban. I would love to mentor people from all different
kinds of backgrounds. But remind me, check in with me of like, hey, my experience is different. Can
you translate this for me? That's how I know that you're thinking critically about it
and applying. It's kind of the same as when you have a, you know, if you've been in a sock for a
while and you have a new analyst. And it's clear that even when I tell you something, you haven't
actually done the legwork to figure this out. Like, oh, it didn't work. I gave up. Tell me what
to do next. It's not linear, right? So I just want to know that what I'm telling you is getting
through and that I am understanding you. So that communication, as long as we can build that,
I know this is going to be a very fruitful experience. And I think Clay should follow up
with that. Yeah, Clay? Sure, sure, I will. I think just taking the first step and to becoming
involved, to be a mentee, to open yourself up to the experience is already a success.
It's about the journey as well, right? It's not about the destination. So if you're learning
and you're growing, that's what it's all about. And half of that is really up to you.
And if I can guide and support you in any way, shape, or form, that's what it's all about for me.
Awesome. And in this case, this is why this is a good time to actually do a call for mentors.
If you want a mentor, right? And you feel like you have something that you can bring to the table.
Remember, this is not about... if you're very good at something, that's great. But if you have
some experience, right? If you bring in a unique background, like Randall said, right? You see
the panel here and you find, hey, I don't see my representation. Then we want you to be here. We
want you to be part of that, so you can help someone like you. So go ahead, hit the Blue Team
Village site, meet the mentor program, go to the forum, and we want to talk to you. We really want
to talk to you. Another great question that we received is, what makes a good mentor? And how
can mentors improve their mentor game? Nohakimi? What makes a good mentor? I'll be honest.
It's going to vary from individual to individual. What works for Clay doesn't work for
Randall, doesn't work for Muteki, doesn't work for Moose. It's going to be individual. And to
Danny's point, if you and I hang out and it's not a match, cool. I'm not mad about it.
I'm still going to help you as much as I can, but if there's a better one, won't. So I think that
what makes a good mentor is what you want to get out of it. And I forgot the second part, so
go ahead. I actually want to jump in on that real quick. Yeah, go ahead. The previous question and
answer, it feels kind of related. So what Randall was saying about this, it
reminded me of the whole idea of like mentoring versus tutoring. I don't want to just be there
to answer some technical question, because it's like when you interview someone, you're not really
looking for someone that may be like compare it back information to you. You want someone that
is going to show you how they think. And I think that that's important for a mentor-mentee
relationship. I, as a mentor, am more interested in helping someone find the answer themselves
and not just giving them that answer. So that's a very important part of that relationship.
And whatever I can do to be transparent about that and to share my experiences and
not what I learned, but how I learned it and connect on a personal level where that's something
that can be communicated well, I think that's an incredibly important part of being a mentor.
Excellent. Moose, do you want to follow up on that? I think you're, I don't know if you're
muted or unmuted. Don't see it. I'm unmuted. Yeah, I'd love to. So I currently mentor
inside of work. We have an internship program. So I've constantly been evaluating myself and
seeing how I do, and I'm always overly critical on myself. But I think that what makes a good
mentor slash mentee bond is the ability to actively listen, but then also off of that
listening, really ask those guiding questions on, you know, where you want to go and get to the
meat and potatoes of goals for somebody that you're trying to help or for someone who's seeking
help. And sometimes it's just asking something in a certain way that's going to clarify that goal.
And just know that when you do that, that's not hard and fast. So a good mentor is also
going to keep it fluid for you. And if you accomplish something, you know, it's still
an accomplishment, even if it's not in your goal set and your goals can change.
Awesome. Thank you, Ali. Yeah, I just wanted to also say, you know, in my personal life,
and just in how I try to navigate this world, I really focus on empathy. And I really focus
on not judging. So trying to be non judgmental with everything. And so I think just that sort
of conscious practice in my regular life will also help me, you know, become a better mentor
for other people, as well as, honestly, I'm still being mentored by so many people.
So I think that's really important that your mentor is never done being a mentee.
Very well said. Yeah. Rubix, I thought you'd raise your hand because you wanted to
say something or that was just waving to the camera.
I literally have a bug flying right in front of my face. And I'm just like,
I can't. Okay, I'm just sorry. So I'll just ignore me.
And just one thing to follow up on that. That was she made an excellent, excellent point,
is that remember, as a mentee, like, cut your mentor, like, we're just remember that, like,
we don't know everything, we are still being mentored. I will sit and listen to like Rubix
school me for hours and hours, because like, that dude is like always gonna know more than I do.
About a lot of things. It's just like how anybody who goes and has a therapist,
therapists have therapists, like, remember that there is that ladder. And that I had tried a
mentor program a while ago by my dear friend. He's Jimmy Vo on Twitter. He had spun up something
like this. And I volunteered for it. I was not ready. I let a couple people down. And I just
I thought I was and I wasn't and I still feel bad about it. So, you know, yeah, we're we are still
being mentored ourselves. And you'll see us at a con be hanging with us. And our jaws are going
to drop at like a certain person that walks by going, hold on, I want their autograph. You know,
we still do that. Like every time Clay walks by. I haven't always. Yeah, nevermind. Sorry.
I don't know. Now you have to answer. Go. What are you going to say?
I was gonna say I'm always asking for Randall's autograph. He still hasn't given it to me yet.
Yeah, that's because every piece of paper has like a signature line
signing over my house to you. I know what you're doing.
I got another interesting question in here. And it's this in here.
Um, this is actually a pretty good question. It says any suggestions for someone with a strong
technical education that will be reentering the workforce after over a decade of changing diapers?
Ruby, you're nodding. Do you want to take this one? I see both.
I just think it's an excellent question. And well, it's not it was not a decade, but I took
two times a year off to go travel in various parts of the world. So I kind of know a little
bit how it feels when you come back. I think, you know, even if like people say that InfoSec is
moving extremely fast, and that everything changes all the time. But in fact, it's always
also the same thing. It's very different, but the foundation is still the same. So yes, the new the
new hack or the new vulnerability is something new. But the basic there, it's, it's, it's injection,
it's a remote code execution, it's, it's whatever it's, there's not a lot of new technique or new
things that are groundbreaking. There's new vulnerability, there's new
various things. So if you have a very good background, I think you'll pick it up very
quickly. Again, I don't think there's more, there's a there's a lot of magic here. You'll
need to read, you'll need to go to some conference, just just keep reading, keep, keep talking with
new people or other people. And then you'll catch up whatever you missed. And I think that if your
foundation is strong, it's going to be, it's going to work for you. Rubix, I see you without the mic.
Oh, sorry, random Rubix. No, no, he was first. So yeah, I've actually hired a couple people in this
situation. And I find that technical skills are easy. The life skills that you learn, whether
it's raising children, or, you know, helping out with your elderly parents, I mean, there's a lot
of reasons why people take leave of absence. And, and that is, is, is valuable experience. So don't
throw it out with the bathwater, you know, bring it, because we need that. We need the, the, the
stuff that you learned as, as part of that life. Us stuck behind a computer, you know, we get stuck
in a box. And we need, you know, fresh perspectives or ways of looking at things, compassion, empathy.
Technical skills is something you'll learn. So yeah, let's, let's, let's jump in. And let's,
let's get it, get it done. I'd say that if you're dealing with, sorry, no, no, go, go, go, go, go,
I'm just gonna interject. If you've been dealing with small children for a decade, you are very
well prepared to deal with consulting. Just gonna throw that out there. Clients and small children,
very similar. Yeah. And my, my, my thing real quick, because I'm talking a lot, but never said
like, just, just the way that the question was phrased, almost makes me think like, they're
worried about it, or they think that it's a detriment. Like, here's something that's really
gonna help you, especially when you come back in. You're eventually going to get to an interview,
where the interviewers are going to be bad interviewers. And they're going to keep trying
to steer that conversation to stuff that maybe you don't know about and always try to steer it back,
use whatever skills that you have to steer the conversation back to make those strengths.
You didn't, you didn't take time off. You ran a small enterprise of people who can't help
themselves. And that's all InfoSec is. We're helping people who don't, can't help themselves.
So that's what you did. That is a core skill. And I haven't changed a diaper for at least a
couple of years now. But yeah, don't you don't, don't approach that as a negative. It's been it.
And my only follow up to that is, if you are naturally inclined to go out to conferences
and talk to people, work on your networking. If you are not, not all of us are, figure out a way,
translate that thing that you're not comfortable doing into something that you are comfortable
doing, which is cultivating a good Twitter feed, cultivating good sources of intel for yourself to
learn things. And like somebody else had said, because my memory is absolute crap. The more
things change, the more they stay the same. Recognize the patterns. You're not that far off.
Like, I guarantee you, you're not as far away as you think.
Hug me.
Yeah, so I'll be honest, like 10 years off, it depends what kind of 10 years off we're talking
10 years, like I kept up with tech, or 10 years I did. And I think the biggest hurdle that you
were going to run into is going to be HR. Once you get past HR, and you talk to me in the interview,
within the first three minutes, I'm gonna know whether you're full of shit or not.
And that's what it comes down to is getting past that HR screen. And I think that's what
a lot of us mentors kind of bring to the table is, look, I know someone at this company that
has this opening you'd be great for, and it's just bypassing the bullshit screens we all have
to go through. And I think that's what a large part of being a mentor is, is don't get discouraged.
Any HR person, and we know this, I don't want to talk shit on HR, but like a little bit.
You know, you take 10 years off, I'm gonna see that his person hasn't been working for 10 years.
But to Danny's point, to everybody else's point, like we all know mothers. Holy shit is that
back-breaking work that it doesn't translate to a resume, but to anyone that has a child,
Jesus, you would put in the hours. So I think the HR screen is going to be your problem,
not the technical interview. Keep your chops up, and you're good,
and all of us will help you as best we can get past that HR hurdle we all face.
I love HR though.
Moose, do you want to say something?
I do. Three things, and I'm going to keep it very short because I know I've talked a lot,
but one, thank you for asking this question. I think it's really important, and not a lot
of people are brave enough to ask it. And thank you for having the strength to put your family
first, because that is something that there are a lot of people in this industry who struggle with
that, and that's super admirable to at least me. So I want to put that out there. The second thing
is to kind of bounce off of No Hack Me and say, not only is what you said true, but there's also
the added layer of that of you're asking questions here, you're probably signing up for this program,
but you're opening a huge door, because sometimes it's about who you know, and I think that being
more involved in the community is really going to be a boon to you. But there are a lot of
volunteer positions that you can volunteer for at InfoSec Cons, especially right now that we're
all remote. So reach out to the different cons that are coming up, volunteer, put that on your
resume, like put your home lab on your resume, put stuff like that on your resume, because it doesn't
need to be, I am at this formal company right now. You can put additional stuff that you've done,
research you've done, education you've kept up with on your resume, write a blog, showcase the fact
that you can write really well on the blue side. If you can write a report, you're golden. And then the
last thing I'll say is, 10 years of changing diapers, I have walked into clients that look
like a diaper barge after a threat actor has hit them. So that's valid experience. And just
know that you've been looking at the things that we look at every day, no matter what.
Awesome. I want to note on this. Oh, well, actually, before I go up, Allie, want to go for it?
Yeah, thanks. I totally agree with everything, you know, everyone said. I also think from sort of a
tactical perspective, you obviously are going to have a lot on your plate, both with career and life.
And I think it's probably just really important for you to do it yourself or get support to do
this. But to really prioritize, what is your sort of attack plan? Where are you going to be focusing
your time, resources, and energy? And trying to figure out, like, maybe kind of doing your own
gap analysis or kind of your own SWOT analysis, your strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, and
threats. And just kind of figuring out, like, what needs to be stronger? What can you work
on? And really kind of strategically thinking about your priorities, because you obviously
are going to have a lot of, you know, restrictions on your time and your resources. And then I think
also, and this is something that hopefully your, you know, potential mentor and network and friends
can help you with. But I think too, given your circumstances, you are going to want to maybe
proactively seek an organization who embraces you, who embraces your background. And I think
that's something that could be really crucial to your success. So I'll just leave it with that.
Yeah, no, I think these are very good points. Actually, I was going to kind of note on that.
If you're dealing with that, I think one of the important things, like it was said by
Nohagmi, HR is going to be one of the main problems you're going to really face, right? But even then,
you know, learn social engineering. There's always one way that you can, you know, speak to someone,
especially they relate. And if you find that way that it can relate to someone, especially,
you know, for many of us, having kids is so relatable, right? You can play that as an
extent and during that HR, you know, stuff, obviously, they're going to look at things like,
you know, have you, you know, when you stop working or not, but then you can you can change
that conversation. And also, it was said before, you know, taking care of someone, you know, even
if it's changing diabetes, you learn a lot of things, you know, risk management, you know,
crisis management, you know, how to respond to incidents, right? So, there's a lot of things
that are analogies to security anyways, because they happen in real life. You can flip all of that
in a way that, you know, say, hey, I might not have in real life, you know, on that technical
subject, but I know what it's like when I have to deal with this. And, you know, and there are many
things in life that align a lot with what we do anyways. So, you know, find a way to kind of,
you can bring and say, hey, I know this. And that life experience sometimes is much more valuable
than the technical experience you can bring. Anyone else want to add something to this? Otherwise,
Ajit, you want to say something? Yeah, go for it. On the topic of conferences, if you have a local
B-Sides chapter, it's a great place to get started. They tend to be very approachable, and most of
them are always looking for help. I know that we are. I help run B-Sides Philly. If you're in the
know, we have a few. Go ahead, no hug me. I'm saying B-Sides DC, B-Sides charm. You want to get involved,
hit me up. Yeah, so as far as... go for it, go for it, Moose. That's all I wanted to say.
Yeah, so I think as far as conference goes, we cover quite a bit of ground in there. I'd
shout out to the Shellcon crew as well. A few of the B-Sides. We got Circle City Con, right?
Yeah, there you go. See, you gotta show this. So, there's plenty of conferences,
some even that I really haven't gone. Hushcon is another fun conference. So,
yeah, get involved on those. But there's another question that came up as well from
the audience. And someone is asking, do any of your mentors help or partake or mentor in the
local high school in any way? Ali? Sorry, a little burn there. Yeah, so I'm actually so excited.
It's a relatively new effort. But I'm in the D.C. area. And I just made a new friend over Twitter.
And he actually has already started an effort to provide free IT and also security training,
basically a program to the Black youth in D.C. who are notoriously historically underserved
and underprivileged. And I'm really honored that he's considering to bring me on to help.
So, I'll have more on that actually soon. But that will be actually primarily for the high
school age for the kids in D.C. Awesome. Rando? Yeah. First of all, plug for a very good friend
of mine. He is on Twitter at Simple Skink, S-K-I-N-K. He gave a talk at Circle a couple
years ago. And this guy has done a ton, a ton of work reaching out to his local school community,
I think in like the Louisville area. So, first point of order is to go follow him,
pick his brain, his DMs are open, he's done. And he actually did a really good talk. So,
talk at Circle City, I think it was like 2017 or 2018. Anyway, on from that, I recently,
not high school kids, but I recently gave a talk to four different classes of middle schoolers.
And that was a complete eye opener about how they give and receive information. And by the way,
if you use Facebook, they will make fun of you. So, I got in by accident because I have
this is gonna sound super pretentious, but the dude who cuts my grass is also a high school
teacher and teaches PE in middle school. And I was like, well, I should be cutting your grass.
First of all, second of all, he got me in there. If somebody is thinking about being a mentor and
trying to get into schools, or if you are in high school and have never gotten a good speaker,
it is incredibly, incredibly hard, I have found to get into schools. It is hard to get them to
return phone calls because like, I actually don't know why. But yeah, so if you're thinking about
mentoring, go follow SimpleSkink. He has fought all of these fights for you already. And if you
want to do it, it is super rewarding. Just know that there's like we talked before about
ways to give and receive information, even among adults, it's hard. So be prepared to really have
to translate. And I want to do more of it, because that is a skill talking to high schoolers that I
have yet to master or that I ever will, because they all stay the same age, and I keep getting
older. I don't know. I don't know. No, I think that's, that's, that's good. Personally, I do
volunteer from time to time in my time. And this is actually one of the things that I found,
you know, the, I go to, you know, maybe not sometimes, I've only been to high school twice,
but I've gone to elementary or junior schools. And one of the coolest things that I like to do
is take some of the badges to those schools and, and use it sometimes as gadgets and props to talk
about hackers and so forth. Because they have a good way to kind of get, you know, everyone engaged,
even if, especially in high school, the times that I use them. So, but yeah, there's some
challenges with that. The place I work there, there is a bit of a program where if you are from
Latin heritage, and you speak Spanish, like in my case, you know, we volunteer to, you know,
go to a university or some other place and kind of, you know, do be on a panel or do a talk
representation. So, yeah, it's slightly different to be mentoring someone, you know, at that level.
It also comes with a few constraints. So, you know, where you do it, how you do it,
you always have to be mindful on both of the sides, especially at that age level,
and the role of a mentor, right? So, whenever I engage in that, I try to make sure that it
is never a one-on-one. Personally, it's more like a setting where it's pretty public,
and it's in a group, you know, setting, just because it's the easiest way to answer many
questions. And also, because I'm not qualified to kind of have that, you know, that setting with
someone, you know, I'm not tutoring. And I think that's very important to kind of touch on this,
right? There's a distinction between tutoring and mentoring. And, you know, that will not be
the demographic that, you know, I personally feel confident to provide some sort of mentoring. I
was a teenager once, and, you know, I felt many things during that age. So, I think that's an
important thing to kind of note. And with that said, we do have another question that came in
as well. And it says, may the panelists speak on, you know, goal-setting over the ambitious goals,
you know? So, if you set an over-ambition goal, how to manage your workload and burnout,
you know, putting pressure on yourself to succeed at all costs. Basically, we're talking about burnout.
Yeah, I can actually, I think I can start to speak on that. So, I have constantly struggled with
trying to do too much and burning out or getting really close to burning out. So, one example is
actually at the start of this pandemic. So, my work started going remote in mid-March.
And around the same time, just right as we went remote, I actually got COVID. And I wound up
being sick for about two, two and a half months. If you ever heard of, like, a COVID long hauler,
that was me. It's horrible. Do not recommend. Zero of 10. Like, do not recommend. But, of course,
what wound up happening was, I had an amazing supportive boss who pretty much let me kind of
just, you know, I went to take, like, a week or two off, maximum. And then I started trying to
work. And I felt, like, I felt a lot of guilt about, like, trying to work when I was still
really sick. And I felt like I didn't perform enough. So, I wound up just taking on an insane
amount of work when I started to feel better. And in the last, like, two or three weeks, I basically
had, like, three major projects all, like, crescendo at the same time. And I hit a point where, like,
I woke up in the morning and I just dreaded the day. And I realized that, like, I kind of did that
to myself. And I have to be realistic about what I'm capable of doing and what I'm not capable of
doing. And I've always been this way. Like, I push so hard and I just keep going. And, like, like I
said, I'm also a part-time grad student. And if anyone has ever been to grad school, like, it's
kind of an insane rush. And it's full of a lot of overachievers. And you have a kind of constant
imposter syndrome where you think that everyone is way smarter than you and they can do the
project in one hour when it takes you, like, 12 or 24, whatever it is. So, you know, I've had to, like,
be careful with myself and let myself just fail a little bit and set smaller goals and, like,
actually delegate where it's possible to delegate. Like, these projects, I could have trained someone
else to do this part or that part or, you know, reassign something. And I, for whatever dumbass
reason, chose not to do that. And that's kind of, like, I'm still, like, paying for that a little
bit. And it's a constant struggle. Anyone else? Moose, I see you. So, that question hits home
because I am known for my burnout. I almost struggle saying no to things when they come in.
And I am a hyper-technical person. So, like, I want to know the inside detail on how everything
works in this problem. I'm also a perfectionist, also a problem. And I have to go ahead and give
a shout out to my intern right now that I have, that I'm mentoring, wrote a blog post this past
week. And part of this blog post was the best advice I've gotten recently was take a break.
And so, for you, like, you're trying to eat the elephant. It's okay. You just have to do it in
parts. And I think having overly ambitious goals is great. I've had them. I was working
beyond full-time doing SOC-IR, completing my master's degree in DFIR at the same time,
and volunteering for another organization. And I didn't sleep much. And that wasn't exactly
healthy. So, you know, as a mentor, I'm never going to say what you should or shouldn't do.
But I might ask a lot of questions and share my life experience and say, hey, you know,
these are the kinds of things that have helped me. Did you remember to eat today? How much have
you slept this week? You know, some things like that that, you know, my boss said to me recently,
I'm taking Monday and Tuesday off, by the way, because I haven't slept much recently. But
they say to me on a frequent basis of, you know, we'll always have IRs, but we only have one Heather.
And I think that's a really good way to look at it for you. Have those overly ambitious goals.
Shoot for the moon. But there's only one you. So keep yourself alive while you're doing it.
Awesome. Rubix? Yeah, I wanted to call out something and give some words to,
you know, what people would feel in different situations. Because there's stress and then
there's burnout. And really there's a difference. And you can have a stressful work career and be
happy and productive. And stress doesn't necessarily have to be bad. Burnout is when
that stress is doing different things to you. So, you know, go Google that stress versus burnout,
and you can kind of see the differences there and help measure yourself. Am I just in a stressful
situation or am I approaching burnout? And because the ways that you respond to that is a little bit
different. So I wanted to throw that out there, give those skills to anybody that's listening
to recognize that and be able to respond accordingly.
Awesome. I'll link to this part of that. So we go into the final notes with a personal note.
There's a co-worker of mine, if he's watching or he will ever watch, that has told me many times,
you said yes, right? You know, you tend to say yes too much. And it is definitely a thing that
some of us learn to deal and learn to... so learn to say no. And it's okay to say no.
There will be more time to try new things and experience things, but it's completely fine. And
the sooner you learn to do that, you will be able to succeed even more because you're able to
funnel all of the time that you have into that one primary task. And instead of, you know,
trying to find more hours of the day that you don't have to do all the other things that you're
raising your hand for. So if you want to learn it from me, then learn to say no. So hi to my
co-worker. All right. So we're at the end of the panel and this is the time for us to basically
end. And I want to give everyone an opportunity. You got about a quick minute to just go through,
you know, last comments regarding the program. Maybe you want some simple advice to end.
It's totally up to you. So, you know, do you want me to do it the same way that we did it before
from the top and the bottom? Or is that fine? Muteki? All right. Take it away.
I just want to say it's been absolutely awesome to work on this and we've gotten
an amazing surge of interest. And I'm super excited to delve into like how this is
going to work. So it's probably, we're not going to wind up with any assignments at least for
probably a week or so. If you know people that are interested in mentoring, please send them over
bootcamp.com. And I just want to say that, you know, we're really we want to be cognizant about
how people have different experiences. And we didn't really have time to address a lot of
the questions that kind of came up. But one of the things that happened was last night a bunch
of us actually had this like random Zoom call. And it wound up being like the most philosophical
Zoom call I think I've ever been on. And one of the things that came up was different experiences.
So my experience as a woman who is also gay in the workforce means that I'm kind of an honorary
man. And that means that my experience of things as like a super assertive, like very outspoken
steamroller of a human being is not going to be the same as a more feminine woman's would be.
And all experiences are valid. And I think all of us that want to be a mentor are trying our
hardest to recognize that those differences exist. And some of the most important things that we can
do is to just believe people. To believe women, believe black people, believe people of
color. And to really like to take that into consideration. So I hope that we're able to
achieve that for all the people that apply to be mentees. Awesome. Yeah, good point. Actually,
just a quick thing. We collected some, I think we so far got a few mentee submissions. Do you
know what count are we? Let me check. We're almost at 200. And a huge surge, mostly mentees. So we
are actively looking for more mentors. And you people are really interested in technical skill
acquisition, developing confidence, interpersonal skills, and imposter syndrome is definitely high
on that list. And also like things like interviews and things like that. And you people love DFIR too.
Like everyone wants to do DFIR. It's great. Awesome. Thank you. All right. So as you heard, we're looking
for mentors. And if you're a mentee, you know, we have a line to go through. So
don't matter. Just come in and sign up. Rando. First of all, suck it red team. Second of all,
just a word about projection, right? Right now, everybody who is either
thinking about being a mentee or has already applied, like don't project yourself out for
failure. And don't project yourself out for like conquering the world. That's a good thing to have.
But take this seriously, right? If you get into this, like get into this groove with us,
and all of a sudden you start projecting about how it's not going to do you any good,
or I'm not a fit for this, or whatever. Always keep in mind to not project. You cannot tell
the future. You don't know for sure if you're going to fail or if you're going to succeed.
Spoiler alert, you're going to do both multiple times. So just take this seriously in the moment.
Every single minute that you do this, that is the minute that you are concentrating on. And
then let that take you forward. Don't project where you're going to end up. Take it seriously,
and I promise we will too. Awesome. Rubix? Do you hear me? Rubix? Rubix? I think he's muted.
No? We'll skip him. Pulling at Clay. Yeah? I don't think he can hear me. We'll skip him for now.
He disconnected. All right, he's coming back. Let's see. Maybe Audio is back on. All right,
awesome. Did my technology fail right at the right moment? Okay. Yeah, your turn. All right,
it's my turn. So yeah, I'm really looking forward to this. I always enjoy hearing what people are
out there and what they're facing, the variety of things. And I do want to echo the, you know,
it's okay to fail and also kind of bring back the burnout thing. I've had a little short stints
of absolutely no technology jobs in between my 28-year career where I've been like,
I'm going to be a bartender or I'm going to help, you know, rebuild houses or, you know,
I mean, it's crazy. You'll get there. You're going to, you know, you're going to be at points
in your life where you're just going to want to do something else. And to make it, you know,
full 30, almost 30 years that I have, you know, you've got to take some breaks and whatnot. So
even if you are not ultimately successful and, you know, have this ramp of exactly you met your goals,
you know, that doesn't mean you failed completely and you can't have success. So,
you know, we'll work together. We'll find some ways, but understand that
we'll all have some bumps and bruises along the way. And I look forward to it.
Awesome. Thank you for that, G.
Yeah, I'd say that success in the program for both parties relies on keeping each other
accountable and kind of holding each other accountable and being active, you know,
an active participant in your role in that. Otherwise it becomes lopsided and it ends up
not working for one of the other party. But I'm super excited to get this kicked off.
You know, it's something that I didn't necessarily have coming up in the industry when I was
starting out and I wish I'd had it. So it's gonna be good, I hope.
Awesome. Allie?
I just want to say that I'm so thankful for being invited to this special group of
amazing people. And I can't wait to help as many folks as we can. And like I said earlier,
just sending the ladder back down. So I can't wait.
Perfect. Thank you. Nohagmi?
Hey, to kind of touch on the earlier point, like stress versus burnout,
to throw it back to a sports ball reference, you know, are you injured or are you hurt?
And I think a lot of our careers, like they say, you know, pick something you love to do,
so you fail to set boundaries, you eventually burn out and learn to hate it. Don't do that.
I think my career is kind of pivoted to things where I have been in incredibly stressful
situations and have kind of walked that line on burning out. The mentor program, I'm super
excited to be a part of it. You're going to get out of it what you put into it. And that's going
to be anything you do in the security industry. Like, caveats, I don't know if we're supposed to
sell ourselves now. You have access to my entire network. I've done a lot of things. I've walked,
anyone who knows me, I've walked a really weird path in life and in a career.
The only rules, I think they're the same rules for all of us. Like, don't make us regret it.
Like, don't be a piece of shit. And eventually one day someone is going to ask you to do the
same thing for them and do it. That's what we're trying to do. None of us are going to be here
forever. We're trying to build something that will be. And I think this mentor program is a
fantastic start. So, please take advantage of it. And yes, find me on the internet. I'll be around.
Awesome. Well said, also. Thank you. Moose. So, I think a lot of good things have already
been said. But for me, one of the things that I would want to leave this off with is
my insane speed doesn't need to be your insane speed. My path is not necessarily your path.
What we're here to do as mentors is be there to lean on, be there to bounce ideas off of,
and help you find your perfect path. Because there's no right or wrong path in InfoSec.
And just as a personal aside, I can be an overwhelming person. Because I'll say,
oh, yeah, I'm doing shellcon things right now. And then I'm going with my other half
to do besides LV things. And he runs HushCon, so I talk about that a lot. And I'll be all over the
place. But that doesn't need to translate to you or any one of us. Like, I'm going to throw
Danny under the bus, because he's used to being there. But he is constantly involved in everything,
which is beautiful. And I love that about him, both as a friend, a human being, and somebody
in InfoSec. But that doesn't need to mean that that's what you have to do to be successful.
And just because you see one of us doing X, Y, and Z things, doesn't mean that that's our trick
or recommendation for success. And you don't even have to be InfoSec right now. You can be a Jason.
You can be whatever you want to be. We just want to help get you to the point where,
like, step by step, you're closer to what's making you happy in life.
Awesome. Where did Clay go? This came and he hid, right? He's like,
I'm out of here. He's playing the, I'm the technical guy, so I'm just going to go and hide.
Clay, you're still around? You want to say something?
That's a negative. He's going to say something. Go, go, go.
I'm just thrilled and honored and humbled to be a mentor. And I look forward to
to what the future holds. Classy Clay words. Love you, man.
That's gooey. Yeah, well, I wanted to say something clever,
but yeah, a lot of folks here already did that. Maybe just one thing. I think you said that
there's 200 people that are subscribed as a mentee. So I know that a few of us today worked on
recruiting more mentors. And I know that I've managed to have four more that I would personally
love to have as mentors. So I'm extremely proud of some of the people that are coming in this
program as mentors as well. So keep following. I think you won't be disappointed with what's coming.
And of course, again, all of us here, I think we're, or you guys are all good people as well.
I think I can learn also from you, and I hope that we will be able to share also together.
Awesome. Thank you for that. So on that note, we actually did get some,
you know, maybe some known figures, some of the ones that are not that much known,
but we're all here trying to give you, you know, some time. And we really want you to maximize the
time. If you at any point, you know, feel like the match isn't working, it's completely fine,
as I said before. We also have a very important rule. We have, if you ever feel like something
isn't right, you can report any sort of concerns. And that's completely anonymous. And, you know,
we're making a path to be able to deal with those things. So we want to make sure that you feel very
comfortable and that there are no shenanigans that are taking place. Will, you know, will any
of those matter or not? Well, we don't know, but we're doing our best part. At this point,
we're running basically out of time. I want to invite you to continue to be here with us
on the Blue Team Village. And then we are going to have game night from the Blue Team Village,
so if you want to see some folks that are here or other people partaking, we encourage you to,
you know, stick around with us, play with that. I want to, the only thing I want to say is thank you,
Miteki, you helped me quite a bit on this. Thank you, all of you, mentors, to be part of this,
you know, program and journey. You know, we're, I'm very looking forward to see what it is. And
just, you know, there are plenty of conferences that are going to happen, so if you want to learn
more or, you know, you want to, you know, partake of something that falls from KernelCon, you know,
say hi to the crew. Shellcon is, you know, doing call for papers, so there's plenty of opportunities.
I'll end with, we have the Meet a Mentor's channel. Come in, sign up. If you're a mentor,
please sign up, reach out to us. And another thing is, if you are one of the villages
in DEF CON and you want to send a mentor, you want to partake with us, you know, come over,
you know, you can take some of the stuff we're trying to build and, you know, take it over to
your village. So, you know, be part of this adventure with us. And with that said, I just
want to say thank you, and, you know, we'll look forward to hearing from you. All right.