1 00:00:00,180 --> 00:00:04,586 - Welcome to the DEF CON 30 Homecoming 101 Track. 2 00:00:04,586 --> 00:00:08,836 (audience cheering and applauding) 3 00:00:11,973 --> 00:00:15,390 So it is been like a very emotional year. 4 00:00:17,070 --> 00:00:18,870 How many people at the beginning of the year 5 00:00:18,870 --> 00:00:21,103 weren't sure if we were even gonna be here? 6 00:00:21,103 --> 00:00:22,560 A show of hands? 7 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,160 Right, it's really questionable. 8 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,110 Month after month, and the stress, 9 00:00:28,110 --> 00:00:32,670 and so being here and seeing my people is really awesome. 10 00:00:32,670 --> 00:00:34,830 So you're awesome, 11 00:00:34,830 --> 00:00:36,544 just thought I'd say that. 12 00:00:36,544 --> 00:00:39,480 (audience applauding) 13 00:00:39,480 --> 00:00:42,840 So for those of you who have not really been to a DEF CON, 14 00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:44,370 or maybe only a DEF CON virtual, 15 00:00:44,370 --> 00:00:46,230 and now this is your first... 16 00:00:46,230 --> 00:00:47,790 First timers, raise your hand. 17 00:00:47,790 --> 00:00:48,840 No shame. 18 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:49,868 Holy shit. 19 00:00:49,868 --> 00:00:51,503 (laughs) 20 00:00:51,503 --> 00:00:53,040 - That's amazing. 21 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:54,240 - Oh well, I mean it makes sense, 22 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:56,070 you'd all be in this room at this time. 23 00:00:56,070 --> 00:00:57,600 So that works. 24 00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:00,923 Okay so you won't get too many of the older references, 25 00:01:00,923 --> 00:01:02,073 but that's fine. 26 00:01:03,030 --> 00:01:05,370 I'll just kind of talk for about 10 or 15 minutes, 27 00:01:05,370 --> 00:01:07,297 and then we're gonna pass off to Melanie 28 00:01:07,297 --> 00:01:10,650 who runs our communications and press 29 00:01:10,650 --> 00:01:15,028 and is sort of the consciousness of the CON. 30 00:01:15,028 --> 00:01:16,230 - Don't put that on me. 31 00:01:16,230 --> 00:01:17,580 - I don't put that... 32 00:01:17,580 --> 00:01:20,103 I lean on Mel for a lot of advice, 33 00:01:20,103 --> 00:01:22,140 and then we're gonna have this great panel 34 00:01:22,140 --> 00:01:27,140 with some new and longtime DEF CON goons and attendees. 35 00:01:27,990 --> 00:01:29,337 And then, we're gonna go to the audience 36 00:01:29,337 --> 00:01:32,340 and ask some question and answer your questions. 37 00:01:32,340 --> 00:01:33,603 So before we do that, 38 00:01:34,710 --> 00:01:36,990 there's a couple of cliche phrases around DEF CON 39 00:01:36,990 --> 00:01:37,823 I just wanna address. 40 00:01:37,823 --> 00:01:41,070 One is DEF CON is what you make of it 41 00:01:41,070 --> 00:01:45,757 and this came about when a lot of people were complaining, 42 00:01:45,757 --> 00:01:48,480 "Hey, I didn't get this one specific experience 43 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:49,500 that I wanted, 44 00:01:49,500 --> 00:01:51,480 or I didn't meet this one person 45 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:53,790 that I knew I was supposed to meet if I came, 46 00:01:53,790 --> 00:01:57,150 or I didn't get to hack the car or whatever." 47 00:01:57,150 --> 00:01:58,507 And other people would say, 48 00:01:58,507 --> 00:01:59,623 "No, well I got to do that. 49 00:01:59,623 --> 00:02:01,707 Why I didn't you get to do that?" 50 00:02:02,550 --> 00:02:05,340 It quickly turned into there's a million ways 51 00:02:05,340 --> 00:02:07,020 to experience this conference 52 00:02:07,020 --> 00:02:09,960 and unlike some other more corporate conferences, 53 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,470 we don't have these pathways totally defined for you. 54 00:02:13,470 --> 00:02:15,360 It's not like you get on the track one, 55 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:17,370 shake the hand with the executive. 56 00:02:17,370 --> 00:02:18,780 and get the sales briefing. 57 00:02:18,780 --> 00:02:20,790 It's really up to you 58 00:02:20,790 --> 00:02:23,160 and it can be very chaotic at sometimes 59 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:25,260 which causes some stress, 60 00:02:25,260 --> 00:02:27,090 but it's also super rewarding 61 00:02:27,090 --> 00:02:29,340 because it's like a choose your own adventure. 62 00:02:29,340 --> 00:02:33,930 We're in this unlimited massive multiplayer universe here 63 00:02:33,930 --> 00:02:36,450 and everybody has had to go through 64 00:02:36,450 --> 00:02:38,940 what you are gonna go through this year, 65 00:02:38,940 --> 00:02:40,860 trying to figure it out. 66 00:02:40,860 --> 00:02:43,170 Some people's focus on the talks. 67 00:02:43,170 --> 00:02:45,450 Some people sit down with their laptop. 68 00:02:45,450 --> 00:02:47,700 Some people sit in Lock Picking Village for half a day 69 00:02:47,700 --> 00:02:49,650 and walk away with a new skill. 70 00:02:49,650 --> 00:02:53,490 And so, don't feel that you missed out 71 00:02:53,490 --> 00:02:54,540 'cause it's impossible. 72 00:02:54,540 --> 00:02:56,550 Around DEF CON, I think three, 73 00:02:56,550 --> 00:02:58,170 I started hearing stories of stuff 74 00:02:58,170 --> 00:02:59,320 that were happening at the CON 75 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:02,433 but I was throwing that I didn't know was happening. 76 00:03:03,570 --> 00:03:07,980 And then, I realized this is bigger than me 77 00:03:07,980 --> 00:03:11,550 and I have to be okay with not knowing everything 78 00:03:11,550 --> 00:03:13,140 that's going on. 79 00:03:13,140 --> 00:03:14,880 That's kind of like... 80 00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:17,280 If you have children, that's kind of letting go. 81 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:19,750 Please tell me the stories. 82 00:03:19,750 --> 00:03:22,770 Please send me the pictures of her first steps or whatever, 83 00:03:22,770 --> 00:03:23,625 because I'm not there. 84 00:03:23,625 --> 00:03:26,730 I missed it but I'm still there, 85 00:03:26,730 --> 00:03:28,867 and that's what you're gonna hear at DEF CON a lot, 86 00:03:28,867 --> 00:03:29,700 "Oh my God, 87 00:03:29,700 --> 00:03:32,198 did you see the cabanas flying through the air last night 88 00:03:32,198 --> 00:03:33,630 when the storm hit? 89 00:03:33,630 --> 00:03:36,480 Did you see the water raining in on the roof last night?" 90 00:03:37,950 --> 00:03:39,630 I guess what I'm getting at is 91 00:03:39,630 --> 00:03:41,400 I want you to go make your own path 92 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:43,500 and I want you to not feel bad 93 00:03:43,500 --> 00:03:45,660 if you didn't see everything. 94 00:03:45,660 --> 00:03:48,660 So that's sort of the it is what you make of it. 95 00:03:48,660 --> 00:03:50,550 If you're very introverted, 96 00:03:50,550 --> 00:03:53,580 maybe take an attempt to maybe extrovert, 97 00:03:53,580 --> 00:03:55,800 but if you can't that's okay 98 00:03:55,800 --> 00:04:00,265 because probably a third of DEF CON is super introverted. 99 00:04:00,265 --> 00:04:03,870 When we built the CON unintentionally, 100 00:04:03,870 --> 00:04:05,010 I'll take credit for it 101 00:04:05,010 --> 00:04:08,640 but really it's an unintentional action, 102 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:11,910 is we grew by word of mouth. 103 00:04:11,910 --> 00:04:14,010 We don't have a marketing budget. 104 00:04:14,010 --> 00:04:17,670 And so every year, based on people's experiences, 105 00:04:17,670 --> 00:04:21,600 they'd tell their friends and it grew very organically. 106 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:26,600 And so, there's no attempt to target a market audience 107 00:04:27,150 --> 00:04:30,303 and get that market audience to attend. 108 00:04:31,350 --> 00:04:36,300 It is what it is through just organic word of mouth. 109 00:04:36,300 --> 00:04:39,240 I think that's one of our greatest strengths 110 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:41,340 because the people are here generally want to be here. 111 00:04:41,340 --> 00:04:44,580 We didn't mind trick them with some Facebook targeted ads 112 00:04:44,580 --> 00:04:45,483 or something, 113 00:04:46,650 --> 00:04:49,030 and because that people are pretty passionate 114 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:51,150 about what they're into 115 00:04:51,150 --> 00:04:53,520 or what they want to try to get out of it. 116 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:55,650 So that's just kind of how we got there, 117 00:04:55,650 --> 00:04:56,583 how we got here. 118 00:05:01,350 --> 00:05:04,920 In the early days, and even today, we never... 119 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:06,567 I come from the bulletin board days 120 00:05:06,567 --> 00:05:09,570 and USENET days after that, 121 00:05:09,570 --> 00:05:11,378 and you never knew the gender 122 00:05:11,378 --> 00:05:13,350 of the person you were talking to. 123 00:05:13,350 --> 00:05:14,850 You didn't know their age. 124 00:05:14,850 --> 00:05:16,830 You didn't know where they were from. 125 00:05:16,830 --> 00:05:18,120 You didn't know anything about them, 126 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:23,120 except what you saw in their messages at 300 baud, 127 00:05:23,310 --> 00:05:25,950 at 1200 baud, 2,400 baud. 128 00:05:25,950 --> 00:05:28,380 And so, we would make your decisions on 129 00:05:28,380 --> 00:05:31,230 if the person was an idiot or not based on what they said 130 00:05:32,250 --> 00:05:34,230 and that just carried forward. 131 00:05:34,230 --> 00:05:36,780 We don't give a shit what you look like 132 00:05:36,780 --> 00:05:39,750 or what you sound like or anything. 133 00:05:39,750 --> 00:05:42,510 We are interested in what's in your brain. 134 00:05:42,510 --> 00:05:46,530 You should be judged here on your ideas, 135 00:05:46,530 --> 00:05:49,500 and your compassion, and how you interact with other people 136 00:05:49,500 --> 00:05:52,533 and not what kind of shoes you're wearing. 137 00:05:53,700 --> 00:05:56,070 And so that might be important elsewhere, 138 00:05:56,070 --> 00:05:58,919 but here you'll see these people in suits, 139 00:05:58,919 --> 00:06:02,167 talking with these teenagers with green hair 140 00:06:02,167 --> 00:06:03,690 and they're having a great time 141 00:06:03,690 --> 00:06:05,490 and it's really kind of a surreal experience 142 00:06:05,490 --> 00:06:07,170 and it's awesome. 143 00:06:07,170 --> 00:06:10,110 So please try to just suspend your eyes 144 00:06:10,110 --> 00:06:13,443 and focus on your experience when you talk to people. 145 00:06:14,571 --> 00:06:15,983 We have had, 146 00:06:15,983 --> 00:06:19,315 you'll hear some things about Spot the Fed contest. 147 00:06:19,315 --> 00:06:23,340 We have had a rocky history a little bit with the feds, 148 00:06:23,340 --> 00:06:25,630 but it's always been tongue in cheek 149 00:06:26,550 --> 00:06:29,583 and I'll tell you a brief story about how that got started. 150 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:32,250 We were organizing, 151 00:06:32,250 --> 00:06:37,250 DEF CON was the first not invite-only hacking conference, 152 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:38,490 30 years ago. 153 00:06:38,490 --> 00:06:40,890 Before, you had to know someone to get in, 154 00:06:40,890 --> 00:06:43,050 to get the invite, to get on the list, 155 00:06:43,050 --> 00:06:45,150 to show up the hacking thing 156 00:06:45,150 --> 00:06:46,080 and I didn't like that 157 00:06:46,080 --> 00:06:48,810 'cause I didn't get invites to some of them. 158 00:06:48,810 --> 00:06:51,390 It's like fuck that I'm making my own show. 159 00:06:51,390 --> 00:06:53,160 But when we made our own show, I was like, 160 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,230 well I don't want that experience to happen to other people. 161 00:06:55,230 --> 00:06:56,820 So we invited everybody 162 00:06:56,820 --> 00:06:58,920 and it wasn't just hackers or phone freakers, 163 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:01,440 we invited artists and musicians and lawyers. 164 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:03,660 Basically in those days, 165 00:07:03,660 --> 00:07:07,320 there was this whole Renaissance sort of pre-wired. 166 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:08,730 The internet could be anything. 167 00:07:08,730 --> 00:07:09,600 It could be art. 168 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:11,970 It could be this utopia. 169 00:07:11,970 --> 00:07:14,070 And so, everybody was invited 170 00:07:14,070 --> 00:07:15,660 and everybody was trying to figure it out. 171 00:07:15,660 --> 00:07:18,150 And so, I had this really eclectic early mix 172 00:07:18,150 --> 00:07:21,180 and actually a friend I made at the very first DEF CON 173 00:07:21,180 --> 00:07:23,703 was a lawyer for Capitol Records. 174 00:07:24,540 --> 00:07:27,240 That summer I was working as an intern 175 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:28,950 at Capitol Records in Hollywood 176 00:07:28,950 --> 00:07:30,750 'cause of this connection I made. 177 00:07:30,750 --> 00:07:33,873 And so it was a really nice blending, 178 00:07:36,819 --> 00:07:38,869 well I knew the feds were gonna be there. 179 00:07:39,720 --> 00:07:43,170 Law enforcement in movies were kind of promoting this image 180 00:07:43,170 --> 00:07:45,180 of the hacker as this mythical person that could fly 181 00:07:45,180 --> 00:07:48,150 and walk through walls and hack computers. 182 00:07:48,150 --> 00:07:53,150 I send a fax to the FBI field office here and I say, 183 00:07:53,737 --> 00:07:55,780 "Hey, I'm Jeff Moss. 184 00:07:55,780 --> 00:07:57,570 We're doing this hacking conference. 185 00:07:57,570 --> 00:07:59,043 You're invited." 186 00:07:59,043 --> 00:08:01,500 It just kind of goes into this black hole 187 00:08:01,500 --> 00:08:03,030 and I sent them to the secret service 188 00:08:03,030 --> 00:08:05,190 and I was trying to blanket everything 189 00:08:05,190 --> 00:08:06,661 so nobody's surprised at the last minute 190 00:08:06,661 --> 00:08:09,600 if they hear that there's a hacking conference in Vegas. 191 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:11,370 Well, the show's getting closer and closer 192 00:08:11,370 --> 00:08:12,360 and I'm starting to get nervous. 193 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:15,187 And so, I call the field office in Vegas and I say, 194 00:08:15,187 --> 00:08:17,760 "Hey Jeff Moss, I'm doing this hacking conference." 195 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:18,593 They say, 196 00:08:18,593 --> 00:08:21,960 "Okay, let me transfer you to the special agent in charge." 197 00:08:21,960 --> 00:08:23,587 He answers the phone, 198 00:08:23,587 --> 00:08:25,737 "Special agent in charge, blah, blah, blah." 199 00:08:25,737 --> 00:08:27,547 And I go into my spiel, 200 00:08:27,547 --> 00:08:29,310 "Hey, we're doing this hacking conference. 201 00:08:29,310 --> 00:08:30,390 I'd love to have you there. 202 00:08:30,390 --> 00:08:31,380 We're gonna have all these hackers. 203 00:08:31,380 --> 00:08:33,630 We're gonna do this, it would be great." 204 00:08:33,630 --> 00:08:36,270 There's this big, long pregnant pause on the phone 205 00:08:36,270 --> 00:08:39,780 like I can feel eyes lasering me through the phone. 206 00:08:39,780 --> 00:08:43,787 And he says, "We are aware of your activities." 207 00:08:43,787 --> 00:08:47,131 (audience laughing) 208 00:08:47,131 --> 00:08:50,190 And I'm like, "Oh great, so you're coming? 209 00:08:50,190 --> 00:08:52,968 So that sounds that's good right?" 210 00:08:52,968 --> 00:08:55,380 He laughs 'cause he knew he was messing with me 211 00:08:55,380 --> 00:08:57,870 and he's like, "No, no we're enforcement 212 00:08:57,870 --> 00:08:59,700 and what you want is policy. 213 00:08:59,700 --> 00:09:01,050 That's Washington, DC. 214 00:09:01,050 --> 00:09:02,227 That's not a field office. 215 00:09:02,227 --> 00:09:03,837 You should talk to them." 216 00:09:04,710 --> 00:09:06,390 Okay, no problem. 217 00:09:06,390 --> 00:09:10,860 First DEF CON comes and goes, shenanigans happen. 218 00:09:10,860 --> 00:09:11,693 It's over. 219 00:09:11,693 --> 00:09:12,780 It's Sunday where cleaning up 220 00:09:12,780 --> 00:09:14,970 and guy comes over to me 221 00:09:14,970 --> 00:09:18,480 and he like shows me his badge. 222 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:20,430 He's like, "Hey, yeah good show." 223 00:09:20,430 --> 00:09:22,779 I'm like, "You said, you were not coming." 224 00:09:22,779 --> 00:09:25,272 And he is like, "Well, you know." 225 00:09:25,272 --> 00:09:28,920 And it's like, "Okay, we can do this. 226 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:30,570 We're looking for you next year." 227 00:09:31,590 --> 00:09:34,470 It turned into this sort of cat and mouse game. 228 00:09:34,470 --> 00:09:36,387 In the early days, if they wore leather loafers, 229 00:09:36,387 --> 00:09:37,680 you knew they were feds. 230 00:09:37,680 --> 00:09:39,750 Then they got sneakers on. 231 00:09:39,750 --> 00:09:40,583 They got smarter. 232 00:09:40,583 --> 00:09:42,840 The fanny packs with the firearms disappeared 233 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:44,820 and they got better and better. 234 00:09:44,820 --> 00:09:46,290 The long story short though 235 00:09:46,290 --> 00:09:49,620 is that created this kind of more accepting 236 00:09:49,620 --> 00:09:50,940 interactive experience, 237 00:09:50,940 --> 00:09:54,030 and that Spot the Fed game unintentionally 238 00:09:54,030 --> 00:09:55,680 really paved the way I think 239 00:09:55,680 --> 00:09:59,220 for no animosity between us. 240 00:09:59,220 --> 00:10:04,020 Our communities kind of game recognizes game a little bit. 241 00:10:04,020 --> 00:10:08,160 And so, all these unplanned experience 242 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:10,320 have led us to this point, 243 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:13,653 this crazy blending of different communities. 244 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:18,343 And so, when people think that there is a master plan... 245 00:10:18,343 --> 00:10:21,270 No man, there's no master plan. 246 00:10:21,270 --> 00:10:24,360 The master plan is community and getting people together 247 00:10:24,360 --> 00:10:25,841 and giving them as many pathways 248 00:10:25,841 --> 00:10:28,020 to make connections as possible. 249 00:10:28,020 --> 00:10:29,053 When you have this many people, 250 00:10:29,053 --> 00:10:30,990 you'll notice this and this is intentional. 251 00:10:30,990 --> 00:10:33,265 When you get this many people, a conference, 252 00:10:33,265 --> 00:10:37,260 it is impossible to not feel lost. 253 00:10:37,260 --> 00:10:38,790 So what do we do? 254 00:10:38,790 --> 00:10:40,260 We fork you off. 255 00:10:40,260 --> 00:10:41,730 Interested in aviation? 256 00:10:41,730 --> 00:10:42,600 You wanna go in aviation? 257 00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:44,100 You wanna go ICS part of aviation. 258 00:10:44,100 --> 00:10:44,933 You want to go... 259 00:10:44,933 --> 00:10:45,766 And next thing you know, 260 00:10:45,766 --> 00:10:47,130 you're sitting at a table with 10 other people 261 00:10:47,130 --> 00:10:49,170 with your interest and you're talking to them 262 00:10:49,170 --> 00:10:51,540 and now you don't have to deal with a thousand people. 263 00:10:51,540 --> 00:10:53,670 You just made 10 friends, right? 264 00:10:53,670 --> 00:10:54,503 You're in the lock picking. 265 00:10:54,503 --> 00:10:55,710 You're in the high security lock picking. 266 00:10:55,710 --> 00:10:57,210 You're in the thing. 267 00:10:57,210 --> 00:10:58,830 Now you've got 10 people around you. 268 00:10:58,830 --> 00:11:00,420 And so we are constantly thinking, 269 00:11:00,420 --> 00:11:01,709 how do we split everybody off 270 00:11:01,709 --> 00:11:04,080 into smaller areas of interest 271 00:11:04,080 --> 00:11:06,663 and then let you decide where you wanna go. 272 00:11:07,680 --> 00:11:08,910 So it does feel big, 273 00:11:08,910 --> 00:11:11,640 but it's also conferences inside the conference, 274 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:13,317 inside the conference. 275 00:11:13,317 --> 00:11:16,170 We're constantly trying to figure out how to do that 276 00:11:16,170 --> 00:11:18,420 and one of our famous strategies 277 00:11:18,420 --> 00:11:20,640 is I give you a lot of rope. 278 00:11:20,640 --> 00:11:24,307 If you want to run, say the AI Village and you say, 279 00:11:24,307 --> 00:11:26,520 "I've got this idea for an AI Village." 280 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:28,650 It's like, "Okay convince me. 281 00:11:28,650 --> 00:11:30,330 Okay, you get a space. 282 00:11:30,330 --> 00:11:32,430 Let's see if you fuck it up. 283 00:11:32,430 --> 00:11:35,250 If you don't, you get more space." 284 00:11:35,250 --> 00:11:36,632 And so when you go in there 285 00:11:36,632 --> 00:11:37,680 and you see a really large village, 286 00:11:37,680 --> 00:11:39,034 it's like they didn't screw it up for years. 287 00:11:39,034 --> 00:11:42,510 (audience laughing) 288 00:11:42,510 --> 00:11:43,590 If you see a small village, 289 00:11:43,590 --> 00:11:45,990 a lot of times their first timer or they're just starting. 290 00:11:45,990 --> 00:11:46,890 They're trying to figure it out. 291 00:11:46,890 --> 00:11:49,080 So your feedback to them could be really valuable 292 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:50,640 because they're just trying to figure out 293 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:52,320 how do they find their way in this community. 294 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:54,000 You'll see villages come and go. 295 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,430 It didn't work out, or the time was wrong, 296 00:11:56,430 --> 00:11:57,863 or there's a lot of interest in blockchain 297 00:11:57,863 --> 00:11:59,550 and then the interest drops 298 00:11:59,550 --> 00:12:03,093 and we repurpose the space to try the next idea. 299 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:07,710 And so again, not a master plan really. 300 00:12:07,710 --> 00:12:11,250 We are just trying to get you all to talk and connect 301 00:12:11,250 --> 00:12:15,420 and carry on that DEF CON spirit throughout the year. 302 00:12:15,420 --> 00:12:16,707 Because you'll find out that the friends 303 00:12:16,707 --> 00:12:18,480 and the relationships you make here, 304 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:20,790 you'll carry throughout the rest of the year. 305 00:12:20,790 --> 00:12:21,930 We do some virtual events. 306 00:12:21,930 --> 00:12:22,830 We have a Discord. 307 00:12:22,830 --> 00:12:24,120 We have forums, 308 00:12:24,120 --> 00:12:27,643 but really man nothing beats this in person feeling. 309 00:12:27,643 --> 00:12:30,003 So try to get the most out of that. 310 00:12:30,886 --> 00:12:35,886 One final thing is the one thing we don't do 311 00:12:37,050 --> 00:12:38,830 is we don't take sponsorships 312 00:12:40,170 --> 00:12:41,543 and that's a conscious decision. 313 00:12:41,543 --> 00:12:42,840 There's probably a lot of money 314 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:45,270 we've been leaving over on the table over the years. 315 00:12:45,270 --> 00:12:48,030 But when we started the conference, 316 00:12:48,030 --> 00:12:49,260 there were no sponsorships. 317 00:12:49,260 --> 00:12:50,880 Nobody was doing this. 318 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:54,930 And so by the time money arrived in the hacking scene 319 00:12:54,930 --> 00:12:56,160 and sponsors arrived, 320 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:59,100 we'd already built ourselves to be self-sufficient. 321 00:12:59,100 --> 00:13:00,420 So we really didn't need it 322 00:13:00,420 --> 00:13:02,523 and we didn't want to be influenced by it. 323 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:06,457 And so if sometimes you look around you're like, 324 00:13:06,457 --> 00:13:08,520 "Man, they should just put an extra video wall there. 325 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:09,600 They should do this extra thing." 326 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:10,433 It's like, 327 00:13:10,433 --> 00:13:12,930 "We could if we started taking sponsorships 328 00:13:12,930 --> 00:13:14,280 and generate a lot more revenue 329 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:15,927 but we don't want to." 330 00:13:17,430 --> 00:13:19,590 That's a pretty intentional decision 331 00:13:19,590 --> 00:13:21,180 because we like our freedom 332 00:13:21,180 --> 00:13:22,950 and we like the ability to tell vendors 333 00:13:22,950 --> 00:13:25,590 or people who might try to intimidate us 334 00:13:25,590 --> 00:13:27,930 to not have a talk on an access control system 335 00:13:27,930 --> 00:13:29,730 or a voting system. 336 00:13:29,730 --> 00:13:31,720 We like not being able to be pressured 337 00:13:32,610 --> 00:13:33,930 through different vendors. 338 00:13:33,930 --> 00:13:37,200 So that's also a little bit of the CON history 339 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:38,460 that you might not, 340 00:13:38,460 --> 00:13:39,480 might be in the back of your head 341 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:42,210 but that is a conscious decision. 342 00:13:42,210 --> 00:13:46,770 Okay, so that's my opening orientation remarks. 343 00:13:46,770 --> 00:13:48,720 All I do the whole CON is I walk 344 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:49,800 and I just orbit and orbit 345 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:51,450 and that's all I do the whole time. 346 00:13:51,450 --> 00:13:53,070 And so if you see me, say hi. 347 00:13:53,070 --> 00:13:54,150 I'm happy to talk to you, 348 00:13:54,150 --> 00:13:55,470 but if it looks like my hair's on fire 349 00:13:55,470 --> 00:13:57,684 and I'm racing somewhere just get outta my way. 350 00:13:57,684 --> 00:13:59,400 (audience laughing) 351 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:00,371 Please. 352 00:14:00,371 --> 00:14:02,790 (audience laughing) 353 00:14:02,790 --> 00:14:03,930 Okay, so I'm gonna hand it off. 354 00:14:03,930 --> 00:14:05,100 Where did Mel go? 355 00:14:05,100 --> 00:14:06,060 Oh, there you are. 356 00:14:06,060 --> 00:14:07,830 Okay, so I'm gonna introduce you to Melanie 357 00:14:07,830 --> 00:14:09,660 who's gonna introduce you to our panelists 358 00:14:09,660 --> 00:14:10,493 and we're gonna go... 359 00:14:10,493 --> 00:14:12,060 They're gonna carry on the conversation 360 00:14:12,060 --> 00:14:14,190 and it's gonna open up to the audience. 361 00:14:14,190 --> 00:14:15,210 So great. 362 00:14:15,210 --> 00:14:16,043 Thank you everyone. 363 00:14:16,043 --> 00:14:19,189 (audience applauding) 364 00:14:24,486 --> 00:14:25,319 - All right. 365 00:14:25,319 --> 00:14:26,490 Thanks Jeff. 366 00:14:26,490 --> 00:14:29,040 A bit of course, correction. 367 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:30,600 I go by Wednesday. 368 00:14:30,600 --> 00:14:31,433 - [Jeff] Wednesday. 369 00:14:31,433 --> 00:14:33,525 - For strangers, so. (laughs) 370 00:14:33,525 --> 00:14:35,040 - [Jeff] You're all strangers. 371 00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:36,571 - And you're all strangers. 372 00:14:36,571 --> 00:14:38,879 Alright, so thank you so much everybody 373 00:14:38,879 --> 00:14:41,730 for joining us today. 374 00:14:41,730 --> 00:14:43,020 I'm really excited about the folks 375 00:14:43,020 --> 00:14:44,910 that we've pulled together today. 376 00:14:44,910 --> 00:14:46,590 They all have very different 377 00:14:46,590 --> 00:14:50,034 and unique experiences with DEF CON. 378 00:14:50,034 --> 00:14:53,760 So I've asked them to share a little bit of their story 379 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:55,980 and how they got involved in the community 380 00:14:55,980 --> 00:14:58,410 to help all of you as you acclimate, 381 00:14:58,410 --> 00:14:59,378 and find your people, 382 00:14:59,378 --> 00:15:02,970 and find your little groups within this very large group. 383 00:15:02,970 --> 00:15:06,870 I am the type that I am very introverted 384 00:15:06,870 --> 00:15:09,870 and I just pretend to be an extrovert for a living. 385 00:15:09,870 --> 00:15:12,270 So if you also feel that way, 386 00:15:12,270 --> 00:15:13,620 there are plenty of corners, 387 00:15:13,620 --> 00:15:15,270 plenty of wonderful people, 388 00:15:15,270 --> 00:15:18,480 and we wanna help you find the folks 389 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:19,557 that you really gel with. 390 00:15:19,557 --> 00:15:21,900 If you are an extrovert, 391 00:15:21,900 --> 00:15:23,430 I don't understand where you come from 392 00:15:23,430 --> 00:15:25,330 but there's also a place for you here. 393 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:28,170 So that being said, 394 00:15:28,170 --> 00:15:29,850 a little bit of background about myself. 395 00:15:29,850 --> 00:15:33,690 As Jeff mentioned, I run the press department, 396 00:15:33,690 --> 00:15:36,120 the communication strategy here at DEF CON. 397 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:38,795 I have been a goon for nine years. 398 00:15:38,795 --> 00:15:41,890 So I have seen a lot of the changes that he talked about 399 00:15:43,620 --> 00:15:45,980 and I actually started by volunteering 400 00:15:45,980 --> 00:15:50,130 with what at the time was called DEF CON Kids. 401 00:15:50,130 --> 00:15:51,600 So we used to have a village 402 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:53,860 dedicated to our youngest hackers. 403 00:15:53,860 --> 00:15:57,727 It eventually evolved into something called Rootz Asylum. 404 00:15:57,727 --> 00:16:00,990 They have since retired as of this year, 405 00:16:00,990 --> 00:16:03,440 but hopefully we will have something taking its place 406 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:04,650 for next year. 407 00:16:04,650 --> 00:16:07,320 So if that's something that's interesting to you, 408 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:08,153 let me know 409 00:16:08,153 --> 00:16:10,320 because we are trying to pull something new together. 410 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:11,460 But that's how I got started, 411 00:16:11,460 --> 00:16:14,040 it was just volunteering with one of these villages 412 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:17,460 and over time there was more needs 413 00:16:17,460 --> 00:16:20,610 and more things that the team needed help with. 414 00:16:20,610 --> 00:16:25,260 Eventually, I hope nobody actually holds me responsible 415 00:16:25,260 --> 00:16:27,153 for the consciousness of DEF CON, 416 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:31,260 but it is part of my professional training 417 00:16:31,260 --> 00:16:34,080 to help organizations be a little bit more empathetic 418 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:35,748 and more inclusive. 419 00:16:35,748 --> 00:16:37,940 So with that being said, 420 00:16:37,940 --> 00:16:41,107 I wanna introduce our amazing panelists 421 00:16:41,107 --> 00:16:44,070 that we've brought together today. 422 00:16:44,070 --> 00:16:47,167 I'm gonna ask each of you to introduce yourselves. 423 00:16:47,167 --> 00:16:49,175 Let us know what you want to be called. 424 00:16:49,175 --> 00:16:51,047 I know all of you by different names 425 00:16:51,047 --> 00:16:52,470 and I wanna be respectful 426 00:16:52,470 --> 00:16:54,660 of what you want to be called by this group. 427 00:16:54,660 --> 00:16:56,685 So let us know what you want to be called. 428 00:16:56,685 --> 00:17:00,335 Let us know how you got introduced into DEF CON 429 00:17:00,335 --> 00:17:04,848 and give us one tip of a do or don't 430 00:17:04,848 --> 00:17:06,780 that you would share with a newcomer 431 00:17:06,780 --> 00:17:09,030 who's here for the first time. 432 00:17:09,030 --> 00:17:10,713 So let's start with you. 433 00:17:12,150 --> 00:17:14,610 - My name is Tennisha Donna Hill. 434 00:17:14,610 --> 00:17:16,113 I prefer to be called T. 435 00:17:17,340 --> 00:17:22,223 I got introduced into DEF CON through BlackGirlsHack. 436 00:17:23,183 --> 00:17:24,875 This is our first year here. 437 00:17:24,875 --> 00:17:28,290 We have a village called Girls Hack village. 438 00:17:28,290 --> 00:17:29,123 So, yeah. 439 00:17:30,390 --> 00:17:31,994 - Do you have a tip for the newcomers 440 00:17:31,994 --> 00:17:33,900 on something that you would recommend they do 441 00:17:33,900 --> 00:17:34,750 or they don't do? 442 00:17:35,700 --> 00:17:38,100 - Plan for the things that you can't plan. 443 00:17:38,100 --> 00:17:42,033 Just keep thinking about all the what ifs and keep planning. 444 00:17:44,670 --> 00:17:46,380 - Hello, my name is Shannon Morris. 445 00:17:46,380 --> 00:17:48,312 I go by Snubs on the internet. 446 00:17:48,312 --> 00:17:50,700 My pronouns are she and her 447 00:17:50,700 --> 00:17:52,733 and I got introduced to DEF CON back in, 448 00:17:52,733 --> 00:17:56,640 I wanna say like 2009 through a YouTube podcast 449 00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:59,100 I do called HAK Five, H-A-K Five. 450 00:17:59,100 --> 00:17:59,933 You can Google it. 451 00:17:59,933 --> 00:18:00,900 It's really good. 452 00:18:00,900 --> 00:18:02,040 Definitely subscribe. 453 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:03,663 Like and subscribe, thanks. 454 00:18:04,770 --> 00:18:07,800 I guess my main thing would be, 455 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,633 please dear God wear deodorant. 456 00:18:10,633 --> 00:18:13,126 (audience laughing) 457 00:18:13,126 --> 00:18:16,293 (panelist applauding) 458 00:18:17,196 --> 00:18:18,990 - Is this on? 459 00:18:18,990 --> 00:18:20,340 Applause out the gate. 460 00:18:20,340 --> 00:18:21,900 Hello, my name is Steven. 461 00:18:21,900 --> 00:18:25,617 I go by @AsifoSays on social stuff there. 462 00:18:25,617 --> 00:18:29,190 I was introduced to Jeff by some individuals on my team 463 00:18:29,190 --> 00:18:30,210 who had been before, 464 00:18:30,210 --> 00:18:32,070 and then we were having a recruiting event. 465 00:18:32,070 --> 00:18:35,070 So I came and I was like, "Oh, this is cool." 466 00:18:35,070 --> 00:18:38,310 One piece of advice that I would say or I guess to do 467 00:18:38,310 --> 00:18:41,460 is whatever remotely interests you go check it out 468 00:18:41,460 --> 00:18:42,960 especially if it's your first time. 469 00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:44,520 There might be something that you weren't expecting. 470 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:46,440 And it's like, "Hey, this is actually pretty cool." 471 00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:48,240 For me was the social engineering community 472 00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:49,417 where they were calling I was like, 473 00:18:49,417 --> 00:18:50,727 "That's pretty cool." 474 00:18:54,317 --> 00:18:58,260 - My name is Michael also known as Sparky. 475 00:18:58,260 --> 00:18:59,640 It's he/him. 476 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:01,991 I started DEF CON 8. 477 00:19:01,991 --> 00:19:06,090 DEF CON 10, I was brought into the knock 478 00:19:06,090 --> 00:19:09,993 and 20 years later I'm sitting on stage. 479 00:19:12,630 --> 00:19:17,430 I guess the one tip I have is look to your left, 480 00:19:17,430 --> 00:19:18,690 look to your right, 481 00:19:18,690 --> 00:19:21,030 these are your people 482 00:19:21,030 --> 00:19:23,220 and take a chance 483 00:19:23,220 --> 00:19:24,570 and talk to them. 484 00:19:24,570 --> 00:19:28,050 You might not kick off a conversation with them, 485 00:19:28,050 --> 00:19:29,910 but the reality is you might 486 00:19:29,910 --> 00:19:31,830 and from there you might end up 487 00:19:31,830 --> 00:19:34,590 in a half dozen other conversations 488 00:19:34,590 --> 00:19:38,310 and it is the three days outta the year 489 00:19:38,310 --> 00:19:40,763 where you're gonna have an opportunity to do that. 490 00:19:41,850 --> 00:19:43,350 Don't miss out on that chance. 491 00:19:44,700 --> 00:19:45,746 - Awesome, thank you. 492 00:19:45,746 --> 00:19:48,630 I wanna add my own tip 493 00:19:48,630 --> 00:19:51,390 which I'm also sharing on behalf of DEF CON. 494 00:19:51,390 --> 00:19:54,510 Do not fuck with the hotel or the casinos. 495 00:19:54,510 --> 00:19:56,100 I'm being serious. 496 00:19:56,100 --> 00:19:56,933 - Yep. 497 00:19:56,933 --> 00:19:58,650 - It is very difficult to find a venue 498 00:19:58,650 --> 00:20:00,480 that will put up with our shenanigans. 499 00:20:00,480 --> 00:20:02,063 Please don't make it harder for us 500 00:20:02,063 --> 00:20:05,760 to host DEF CON in future years. 501 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:06,593 Okay? 502 00:20:06,593 --> 00:20:10,410 Do not fuck with our hotels or the casinos 503 00:20:10,410 --> 00:20:11,580 that have opened their doors 504 00:20:11,580 --> 00:20:14,610 to let our community come in and be together. 505 00:20:14,610 --> 00:20:16,683 So that's my tip. 506 00:20:18,420 --> 00:20:19,253 So one of the things, 507 00:20:19,253 --> 00:20:21,355 and Jeff touched on this a bit as well, 508 00:20:21,355 --> 00:20:23,563 but one of the things that I think is so important 509 00:20:23,563 --> 00:20:25,553 and is different about DEF CON 510 00:20:25,553 --> 00:20:28,440 compared to what we might consider 511 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:31,351 to be a professional info sec conference. 512 00:20:31,351 --> 00:20:33,663 There's an example down the road. 513 00:20:35,250 --> 00:20:38,767 It's that DEF CON isn't just a transaction of, 514 00:20:38,767 --> 00:20:40,886 "Hey, we went to this conference and did this thing." 515 00:20:40,886 --> 00:20:44,670 But DEF CON really is a community above and beyond 516 00:20:44,670 --> 00:20:48,180 what is gonna happen over the next three days this week. 517 00:20:48,180 --> 00:20:51,930 And so, I wanna ask our panelists here 518 00:20:51,930 --> 00:20:55,635 to talk a little bit about what did you do to engage 519 00:20:55,635 --> 00:20:59,280 in the community outside of the three days 520 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:01,455 that we have together every year? 521 00:21:01,455 --> 00:21:04,740 What is some advice that you would share with everybody 522 00:21:04,740 --> 00:21:07,440 in terms of how to make DEF CON 523 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:09,723 more than just a transactional event? 524 00:21:18,509 --> 00:21:19,830 - That's a really good question. 525 00:21:19,830 --> 00:21:20,663 - I don't think her mic is on. 526 00:21:20,663 --> 00:21:22,953 - Is her mic on? - Yeah, her mic. 527 00:21:26,310 --> 00:21:28,620 - Sorry, can we have somebody else while we try to... 528 00:21:28,620 --> 00:21:31,169 - No, alright. 529 00:21:31,169 --> 00:21:32,250 - We'll get back. 530 00:21:32,250 --> 00:21:33,083 Is it on now? 531 00:21:33,083 --> 00:21:34,860 - Yes. - Okay. 532 00:21:34,860 --> 00:21:36,420 - That's a really good question. 533 00:21:36,420 --> 00:21:37,373 Thanks for making me first. 534 00:21:37,373 --> 00:21:40,650 (Melanie and Michael laughing) 535 00:21:40,650 --> 00:21:41,973 Connecting with people, 536 00:21:43,290 --> 00:21:45,540 join organization, 537 00:21:45,540 --> 00:21:48,630 for me personally, I'll speak from my experience. 538 00:21:48,630 --> 00:21:49,837 I joined BlackGirlsHack. 539 00:21:49,837 --> 00:21:52,533 I'm the director of policy over there. 540 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,070 It was easy for me to connect and grow, 541 00:21:56,070 --> 00:21:58,740 even though we all live across the country 542 00:21:58,740 --> 00:22:01,030 with people in the cyberspace 543 00:22:02,245 --> 00:22:04,740 and that develops relationships 544 00:22:04,740 --> 00:22:07,650 where some of these people are not my friends. 545 00:22:07,650 --> 00:22:08,483 I can call on them. 546 00:22:08,483 --> 00:22:09,316 I have mentors. 547 00:22:09,316 --> 00:22:12,600 I have different people, if something happens at work, 548 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:13,470 I can lean on. 549 00:22:13,470 --> 00:22:16,350 So for me, it's continuous, 550 00:22:16,350 --> 00:22:20,943 continually connecting and share with other people. 551 00:22:23,580 --> 00:22:27,180 - The first year I came here to DEF CON was back in 2009 552 00:22:27,180 --> 00:22:28,830 and it was overwhelming 553 00:22:28,830 --> 00:22:31,380 and I'll be very transparent with you. 554 00:22:31,380 --> 00:22:33,840 I have crazy imposter syndrome 555 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:35,689 and being around so many smart people 556 00:22:35,689 --> 00:22:40,530 made me feel like I didn't know enough to be here. 557 00:22:40,530 --> 00:22:43,140 So when I came home from DEF CON 558 00:22:43,140 --> 00:22:46,030 and I started doing shows on YouTube, 559 00:22:46,030 --> 00:22:48,270 I decided to really delve into things 560 00:22:48,270 --> 00:22:50,073 and start educating myself. 561 00:22:50,073 --> 00:22:53,400 The way that I tried to become a part of the community 562 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:56,040 was by introducing tutorials on things 563 00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:57,720 that I was truly, really interested in. 564 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,323 I like Wireshark series and stuff like that. 565 00:23:02,730 --> 00:23:05,280 By learning those things myself 566 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:07,950 and by delving into it like a noob 567 00:23:07,950 --> 00:23:10,477 and completely just telling people, 568 00:23:10,477 --> 00:23:12,840 "Hey, I'm a noob too. It's okay. 569 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,480 It's okay to learn all these things and educate yourself. 570 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:16,950 That's totally fine." 571 00:23:16,950 --> 00:23:19,020 I learned coming back the next year 572 00:23:19,020 --> 00:23:21,116 that everybody else is more than happy 573 00:23:21,116 --> 00:23:22,980 to share their knowledge 574 00:23:22,980 --> 00:23:24,300 and that was the biggest thing 575 00:23:24,300 --> 00:23:26,623 that I brought home from DEF CON, 576 00:23:26,623 --> 00:23:28,136 after going a couple of years, 577 00:23:28,136 --> 00:23:32,220 was that people are more than willing 578 00:23:32,220 --> 00:23:35,850 and more than happy to teach you new concepts, 579 00:23:35,850 --> 00:23:38,970 teach you new techniques about information security, 580 00:23:38,970 --> 00:23:43,080 and privacy, hacking in general. 581 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:45,480 There's so much more that you can learn 582 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,870 when you are willing to get yourself out there 583 00:23:48,870 --> 00:23:51,990 and kind of combat your own imposter syndrome 584 00:23:51,990 --> 00:23:52,897 and just tell people, 585 00:23:52,897 --> 00:23:55,560 "Hey, I don't know how this works. 586 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,437 Can you tell me like I'm five years old?" 587 00:23:59,730 --> 00:24:00,630 By doing that, 588 00:24:00,630 --> 00:24:03,780 I really, really felt like a part of this community. 589 00:24:03,780 --> 00:24:05,160 And through the years, 590 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:07,973 it's become strong and stronger to the point 591 00:24:07,973 --> 00:24:12,240 where I came back this year after being gone for two years. 592 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:14,280 I got ambushed by a few friends in the hallway 593 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:15,990 and I started bawling my eyes out 594 00:24:15,990 --> 00:24:17,790 'cause I was so happy to see them. 595 00:24:17,790 --> 00:24:21,180 It truly it does turn into a family 596 00:24:21,180 --> 00:24:23,610 once you find your people here. 597 00:24:23,610 --> 00:24:26,430 I think it really just takes getting outta your shell 598 00:24:26,430 --> 00:24:29,133 and just being willing to talk to people. 599 00:24:31,226 --> 00:24:33,168 - For me, this is my second DEF CON. 600 00:24:33,168 --> 00:24:36,420 The first one I went to was like right before the pandemic. 601 00:24:36,420 --> 00:24:37,253 When the first one, 602 00:24:37,253 --> 00:24:39,110 I probably just knew people on my team 603 00:24:39,110 --> 00:24:41,520 or I'd worked with directly before. 604 00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:42,480 Since then, 605 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:44,550 the way that I've probably had the most interaction 606 00:24:44,550 --> 00:24:47,280 with people in this community is at my local conferences 607 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,050 or just other conferences that I travel to 608 00:24:49,050 --> 00:24:50,070 'cause I imagine you guys 609 00:24:50,070 --> 00:24:52,260 probably go to other conferences there. 610 00:24:52,260 --> 00:24:55,826 And then, also people that have funny memes on Twitter. 611 00:24:55,826 --> 00:24:57,783 That's my tribe. 612 00:24:59,576 --> 00:25:00,991 And so now when I come back around here, 613 00:25:00,991 --> 00:25:02,310 I might bump it to people 614 00:25:02,310 --> 00:25:03,457 or maybe just through Twitter and say, 615 00:25:03,457 --> 00:25:04,950 "Hey, are you gonna be around?" 616 00:25:04,950 --> 00:25:06,960 And then, just catching up with people that way 617 00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:08,220 and that's helped me a lot. 618 00:25:08,220 --> 00:25:10,270 I feel like I know a lot more people now. 619 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,700 - So for me, when I started coming to DEF CON, 620 00:25:17,700 --> 00:25:19,800 I was actually the station manager 621 00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:24,063 for the world's largest online punk rock station. 622 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:28,320 I had bought a computer a year before that 623 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,945 and I was like computers got that. 624 00:25:31,945 --> 00:25:34,590 And so, I showed up at DEF CON 625 00:25:34,590 --> 00:25:38,220 and I totally rocked the imposter syndrome, 626 00:25:38,220 --> 00:25:39,420 sat down at the table, 627 00:25:39,420 --> 00:25:42,310 and had my head completely blown 628 00:25:43,530 --> 00:25:44,945 to the point where it was a little panicky too 629 00:25:44,945 --> 00:25:45,778 'cause you're like, 630 00:25:45,778 --> 00:25:48,207 "Oh shit, I'm way out of my element." 631 00:25:49,500 --> 00:25:50,333 After that, 632 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:54,240 I attempted to try to get a press pass 633 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:58,290 and was roadblocked year after year. 634 00:25:58,290 --> 00:26:00,588 So I eventually found another methodology. 635 00:26:00,588 --> 00:26:01,721 - Not by me, not by me. 636 00:26:01,721 --> 00:26:03,586 (Michael laughing) 637 00:26:03,586 --> 00:26:06,270 - No, no, not by Mel. 638 00:26:06,270 --> 00:26:08,970 But yeah, I found a different way of doing it. 639 00:26:08,970 --> 00:26:12,348 I made friends and started talking with those people 640 00:26:12,348 --> 00:26:15,810 and handed out cheesy business cards 641 00:26:15,810 --> 00:26:18,616 and an unfortunate event happened 642 00:26:18,616 --> 00:26:21,870 and they needed somebody to step in 643 00:26:21,870 --> 00:26:23,403 and help out with DCT. 644 00:26:25,126 --> 00:26:27,120 I was sitting at the Alexis Park 645 00:26:27,120 --> 00:26:30,187 and my two coworkers walk past me and I'm like, 646 00:26:30,187 --> 00:26:31,830 "What are you guys doing here?" 647 00:26:31,830 --> 00:26:32,663 And they're like, 648 00:26:32,663 --> 00:26:35,817 "Oh, somebody reached out to us and asked us to set up DCT. 649 00:26:35,817 --> 00:26:36,650 And I was like, 650 00:26:37,657 --> 00:26:39,660 "Seriously, I handle the business cards 651 00:26:39,660 --> 00:26:41,337 and they get the goon badge." 652 00:26:42,450 --> 00:26:47,450 So I made a stink and invited myself into their team 653 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:50,430 and next thing you know I was hanging APs 654 00:26:50,430 --> 00:26:52,890 and the rest is kind of a history. 655 00:26:52,890 --> 00:26:56,250 For me at home, I don't longer live in a large city. 656 00:26:56,250 --> 00:26:58,020 I live in a small town. 657 00:26:58,020 --> 00:27:00,780 I live in a small town that has been transitioning 658 00:27:00,780 --> 00:27:03,570 from being in mill town or an industrial town 659 00:27:03,570 --> 00:27:08,193 into being a new or trying to reinvent itself. 660 00:27:09,270 --> 00:27:10,413 This small town, 661 00:27:11,310 --> 00:27:14,580 they don't embrace technology. 662 00:27:14,580 --> 00:27:18,420 It is very hands off for them, 663 00:27:18,420 --> 00:27:19,860 but I'm opening a Makerspace 664 00:27:19,860 --> 00:27:23,940 and I'm getting the community to try to learn 665 00:27:23,940 --> 00:27:25,295 about the maker community. 666 00:27:25,295 --> 00:27:28,380 From there, start to bridge that gap 667 00:27:28,380 --> 00:27:30,090 and start to introduce technology 668 00:27:30,090 --> 00:27:33,120 and start to introduce a new mindset to them. 669 00:27:33,120 --> 00:27:37,173 So that's the part I try to give back to the community. 670 00:27:38,100 --> 00:27:38,933 - Awesome. 671 00:27:38,933 --> 00:27:42,180 I loved all those ideas and I love all your stories. 672 00:27:42,180 --> 00:27:44,067 The other thing that I will add is that 673 00:27:44,067 --> 00:27:46,470 if you aren't really sure where to start 674 00:27:46,470 --> 00:27:49,650 and you haven't quite found your group of folks yet, 675 00:27:49,650 --> 00:27:53,100 there is an organization called the Lonely Hacker Club. 676 00:27:53,100 --> 00:27:55,396 So if you wanna look them up and connect with them, 677 00:27:55,396 --> 00:27:58,590 they do a really good job of helping people 678 00:27:58,590 --> 00:28:01,170 like matching them with folks who share interests 679 00:28:01,170 --> 00:28:05,040 in helping you locate certain corners within DEF CON 680 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,440 and within the community where you can meet new folks. 681 00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:08,642 So that's a good resource 682 00:28:08,642 --> 00:28:12,063 if you're looking for some additional support. 683 00:28:12,063 --> 00:28:13,350 So that being said, 684 00:28:13,350 --> 00:28:16,170 I wanna give folks time to ask questions 685 00:28:16,170 --> 00:28:17,430 so you can pick the brains 686 00:28:17,430 --> 00:28:19,444 of these really smart people up here. 687 00:28:19,444 --> 00:28:22,620 We do have roaming mics. 688 00:28:22,620 --> 00:28:24,840 So if you have a question that you'd like to ask, 689 00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:26,010 just raise your hand 690 00:28:26,010 --> 00:28:30,213 and the goons will be bringing the mic to you. 691 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:35,033 - Yes. 692 00:28:35,033 --> 00:28:36,860 - I'm just gonna say this to start off with. 693 00:28:36,860 --> 00:28:41,670 My expertise is an administrative and operational. 694 00:28:41,670 --> 00:28:44,070 So if you're gonna ask me a question about the knock 695 00:28:44,070 --> 00:28:45,423 and where the pixies go, 696 00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:49,140 I'll do my best 697 00:28:49,140 --> 00:28:51,540 but most likely I'll just give you my Twitter handle 698 00:28:51,540 --> 00:28:53,290 and I will get you an answer later. 699 00:28:54,990 --> 00:28:56,403 - I see a hand back there. 700 00:28:57,420 --> 00:28:58,530 - Raise your hand really high 701 00:28:58,530 --> 00:29:00,030 so we can see if you have a question. 702 00:29:00,030 --> 00:29:00,863 - I see one there. 703 00:29:00,863 --> 00:29:01,870 - We can get a mic to you. 704 00:29:03,030 --> 00:29:04,170 - Where are the mics? 705 00:29:04,170 --> 00:29:05,289 - Oh, make 'em run. 706 00:29:05,289 --> 00:29:06,534 Make him run. 707 00:29:06,534 --> 00:29:08,130 - I see a mic person running. 708 00:29:08,130 --> 00:29:09,006 - There you go. 709 00:29:09,006 --> 00:29:10,673 - Run, run Sir. Run. 710 00:29:11,803 --> 00:29:13,470 - [Attendee 1] Thank you. - Yes. 711 00:29:13,470 --> 00:29:14,303 - Hi. 712 00:29:14,303 --> 00:29:15,136 Oh, wow. 713 00:29:15,136 --> 00:29:17,190 I appreciate you, 714 00:29:17,190 --> 00:29:19,020 I appreciate you asking everyone 715 00:29:19,020 --> 00:29:21,900 not to fuck with the casinos and the hotels. 716 00:29:21,900 --> 00:29:23,370 How about each other? 717 00:29:23,370 --> 00:29:26,002 The reputation is that, 718 00:29:26,002 --> 00:29:30,210 you enter a DEF CON wifi and it's toxic 719 00:29:30,210 --> 00:29:32,634 and why is that okay if that's true? 720 00:29:32,634 --> 00:29:35,493 And if it's not true, please dispel. 721 00:29:37,140 --> 00:29:39,090 - I just wanna make sure I understood the question. 722 00:29:39,090 --> 00:29:41,270 So tell me if I'm getting this wrong. 723 00:29:41,270 --> 00:29:43,500 The question is why is there not a rule 724 00:29:43,500 --> 00:29:45,300 about not fucking with each other 725 00:29:45,300 --> 00:29:47,520 in terms of the wifi network 726 00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,040 and everyone's connected devices? 727 00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:51,065 Did I get it? 728 00:29:51,065 --> 00:29:52,140 Okay. 729 00:29:52,140 --> 00:29:53,643 It's a very good question. 730 00:29:54,553 --> 00:29:58,532 I don't have a 100% definitive answer for you, 731 00:29:58,532 --> 00:30:02,090 but I'm gonna tell you the way that we're thinking about it 732 00:30:02,090 --> 00:30:05,160 is this is a hacker conference. 733 00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:08,010 We expect people to hack on things. 734 00:30:08,010 --> 00:30:09,549 We're also very mindful of the fact 735 00:30:09,549 --> 00:30:13,410 that members of our community fall along 736 00:30:13,410 --> 00:30:16,140 a very long moral spectrum 737 00:30:16,140 --> 00:30:19,350 in terms of what is considered ethical hacking 738 00:30:19,350 --> 00:30:23,070 and what is kind of everybody's comfort 739 00:30:23,070 --> 00:30:24,602 and boundary with that. 740 00:30:24,602 --> 00:30:27,010 We have to be realistic about that 741 00:30:27,900 --> 00:30:31,350 because we have anonymous attendance. 742 00:30:31,350 --> 00:30:33,840 I don't actually know who is in this room. 743 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:34,673 That's on purpose. 744 00:30:34,673 --> 00:30:37,110 We don't want governments and other agencies 745 00:30:37,110 --> 00:30:40,890 to be able to come and get it an attendee list from us. 746 00:30:40,890 --> 00:30:42,750 So there is a little bit, 747 00:30:42,750 --> 00:30:45,150 I think of self-awareness 748 00:30:45,150 --> 00:30:46,770 of what kind of environment we're in 749 00:30:46,770 --> 00:30:49,931 from a security perspective while we're here. 750 00:30:49,931 --> 00:30:53,700 And so, we do try to provide advice 751 00:30:53,700 --> 00:30:56,310 on how to protect yourself, how to protect your networks. 752 00:30:56,310 --> 00:30:59,884 We advise you don't bring your corporate devices here. 753 00:30:59,884 --> 00:31:02,340 But at the same time 754 00:31:02,340 --> 00:31:06,030 I wanna also acknowledge the fact that in 2022, 755 00:31:06,030 --> 00:31:10,350 if you don't feel safe using technology 756 00:31:10,350 --> 00:31:11,310 within the DEF CON space, 757 00:31:11,310 --> 00:31:13,410 I think we also need to be talking about 758 00:31:13,410 --> 00:31:16,210 how safe our normal everyday networks are. 759 00:31:16,210 --> 00:31:20,760 So there's a lot of advice about don't bring smartphones, 760 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:22,938 don't use wifi, don't use all of this, 761 00:31:22,938 --> 00:31:24,720 when you come to DEF CON 762 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,480 and people are putting all their devices in fair days. 763 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:29,952 If you are a high risk high target individual 764 00:31:29,952 --> 00:31:33,480 where you know nation states are targeting you, 765 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:37,230 I think that's all applicable advice. 766 00:31:37,230 --> 00:31:39,420 But for most of us, 767 00:31:39,420 --> 00:31:41,880 the types of things that I do to protect myself 768 00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:45,030 when I'm in DEF CON are the things I do every single day 769 00:31:45,030 --> 00:31:48,633 because those threats exist even when the hackers go home. 770 00:31:49,770 --> 00:31:53,118 So I don't know if that's a satisfactory answer for you, 771 00:31:53,118 --> 00:31:54,330 but that's at least the way 772 00:31:54,330 --> 00:31:57,120 that we've been thinking about it in terms of DEF CON. 773 00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,450 We hope that everybody is respectful of each other, 774 00:32:00,450 --> 00:32:01,878 but this is also a hacker conference 775 00:32:01,878 --> 00:32:04,710 and we want people to be able to learn 776 00:32:04,710 --> 00:32:06,116 and develop new skills 777 00:32:06,116 --> 00:32:07,785 and to be able to find vulnerability 778 00:32:07,785 --> 00:32:10,205 so that they can ultimately be fixed 779 00:32:10,205 --> 00:32:12,593 but we can't enforce that that's what people do 780 00:32:12,593 --> 00:32:16,056 with the knowledge that they gain. 781 00:32:16,056 --> 00:32:20,217 - I don't know if I could add a little bit extra. 782 00:32:20,217 --> 00:32:25,217 Mel is a hundred percent correct, but we do offer... 783 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:28,590 So we have DEF CON Open. 784 00:32:28,590 --> 00:32:31,857 It is the wild west and a great experience 785 00:32:31,857 --> 00:32:33,783 if you have not tried it yet. 786 00:32:35,220 --> 00:32:36,780 And then, we have DEF CON, 787 00:32:36,780 --> 00:32:39,370 which you formally known as DEF CON Secure 788 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:42,842 and there's tons of information available 789 00:32:42,842 --> 00:32:46,522 at wifiregdefcon.org. 790 00:32:46,522 --> 00:32:51,187 I definitely recommend you visit there. 791 00:32:51,187 --> 00:32:54,543 And then, the question about the casino floor. 792 00:32:55,590 --> 00:32:56,423 Yeah. 793 00:32:56,423 --> 00:32:59,108 I mean part of my French but don't shit in the pool. 794 00:32:59,108 --> 00:33:00,830 It is... 795 00:33:02,220 --> 00:33:03,750 They don't mess around. 796 00:33:03,750 --> 00:33:04,650 That's a crime. 797 00:33:04,650 --> 00:33:09,650 It is a crime to attack a company, a person, anything right? 798 00:33:11,991 --> 00:33:16,991 They don't look at it as you being experimenting 799 00:33:17,340 --> 00:33:22,080 or there is no three day free pass in Las Vegas. 800 00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:25,140 You step outta line and they will respond 801 00:33:25,140 --> 00:33:26,190 with their full force 802 00:33:26,190 --> 00:33:28,980 and they brought extra force for this weekend. 803 00:33:28,980 --> 00:33:30,200 So yeah... 804 00:33:32,875 --> 00:33:36,210 You got a sandbox, go build castles, 805 00:33:36,210 --> 00:33:38,070 tear down castles. 806 00:33:38,070 --> 00:33:39,870 Do it in this environment. 807 00:33:39,870 --> 00:33:41,370 Everybody's gonna leave happy. 808 00:33:42,990 --> 00:33:45,360 - You are the best bad cop to my good cop. 809 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:46,660 Thank you for adding that. 810 00:33:48,150 --> 00:33:50,490 Any other questions from the audience? Yep. 811 00:33:50,490 --> 00:33:51,323 - [Attendee 2] Hey. 812 00:33:51,323 --> 00:33:53,820 So most conferences I go to, 813 00:33:53,820 --> 00:33:57,300 I leave with a bag full of stuff. 814 00:33:57,300 --> 00:33:59,610 Come here, everyone tells me I'm at the wrong place. 815 00:33:59,610 --> 00:34:01,110 So I'm just wondering, 816 00:34:01,110 --> 00:34:04,503 is there a place to get free swag anywhere here? 817 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:07,230 - Yes. - Yeah. 818 00:34:07,230 --> 00:34:08,630 - Snub should take that one. 819 00:34:09,990 --> 00:34:11,790 - Oh my gosh. 820 00:34:11,790 --> 00:34:14,370 Go to the sticker swap. 821 00:34:14,370 --> 00:34:16,533 You can get so many stickers. 822 00:34:17,430 --> 00:34:19,601 I have a friend who literally throws 823 00:34:19,601 --> 00:34:22,710 little rubber ducks at people, 824 00:34:22,710 --> 00:34:24,543 over and over again. 825 00:34:25,410 --> 00:34:26,352 I had a friend last night 826 00:34:26,352 --> 00:34:29,266 that gave me a little action figure for his company. 827 00:34:29,266 --> 00:34:32,100 You can find stuff all over the place. 828 00:34:32,100 --> 00:34:33,330 People are handing out swag. 829 00:34:33,330 --> 00:34:34,610 - [Attendee 2] Would you introduce me to your friend 830 00:34:34,610 --> 00:34:35,962 'cause I like action figures? 831 00:34:35,962 --> 00:34:37,280 - I mean like... 832 00:34:38,340 --> 00:34:40,173 Okay Carl, we can go find 'em. 833 00:34:42,482 --> 00:34:43,622 Full disclosure, 834 00:34:43,622 --> 00:34:46,200 I am volunteering at the HAK Five booth. 835 00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:47,940 But straight up with a purchase, 836 00:34:47,940 --> 00:34:49,530 we're giving out free battery packs. 837 00:34:49,530 --> 00:34:50,970 You can find stuff all over the place. 838 00:34:50,970 --> 00:34:52,620 So yeah, definitely. 839 00:34:52,620 --> 00:34:54,180 Go to the sticker swap, I'm gonna be there. 840 00:34:54,180 --> 00:34:55,580 I'll give you some stickers. 841 00:34:56,730 --> 00:34:59,580 - We're having a networking event tonight. 842 00:34:59,580 --> 00:35:01,050 If you come to our networking event, 843 00:35:01,050 --> 00:35:02,650 you will have swag bags for you. 844 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:05,393 - [Attendee 2] Oh damn, I know where I'm going. 845 00:35:06,870 --> 00:35:09,180 - Is that at the Girls Hack Village? 846 00:35:09,180 --> 00:35:10,170 - Girls Hack Village 847 00:35:10,170 --> 00:35:15,170 and in the Flamingo, Virginia City III. 848 00:35:15,300 --> 00:35:17,220 Sorry, it's very long. 849 00:35:17,220 --> 00:35:18,180 So you guys come there. 850 00:35:18,180 --> 00:35:22,290 We're also having a nineties party tomorrow 851 00:35:22,290 --> 00:35:23,700 here in the Caesars Forum. 852 00:35:23,700 --> 00:35:26,310 So, everyone is welcome. 853 00:35:26,310 --> 00:35:27,450 So we'll have swag. 854 00:35:27,450 --> 00:35:28,710 So just come visit us, 855 00:35:28,710 --> 00:35:30,438 a small little promo. 856 00:35:30,438 --> 00:35:31,290 - Awesome. 857 00:35:31,290 --> 00:35:33,720 But the reason you won't get a DEF CON swag bag 858 00:35:33,720 --> 00:35:35,142 when you register is, as Jeff mentioned, 859 00:35:35,142 --> 00:35:37,260 we don't have corporate sponsors. 860 00:35:37,260 --> 00:35:41,340 And so, that swag is either gonna come from the vendors 861 00:35:41,340 --> 00:35:44,161 who are sponsoring individual villages 862 00:35:44,161 --> 00:35:47,430 or from attendees who are being very generous 863 00:35:47,430 --> 00:35:49,680 in sharing things with the community. 864 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,060 I think one thing to note 865 00:35:51,060 --> 00:35:53,850 that I think a lot of first time attendees may not know 866 00:35:53,850 --> 00:35:56,400 is that DEF CON operates a little bit 867 00:35:56,400 --> 00:36:00,207 like a platform where we provide the space 868 00:36:00,207 --> 00:36:03,030 for people to create villages, 869 00:36:03,030 --> 00:36:06,355 but the villages run their own content and programming 870 00:36:06,355 --> 00:36:09,150 which means that they may have sponsors 871 00:36:09,150 --> 00:36:10,987 but that sponsor only sponsors that room 872 00:36:10,987 --> 00:36:14,670 and their relationship is with the village not with DEF CON. 873 00:36:14,670 --> 00:36:19,259 So you may find swag at different parts of conference 874 00:36:19,259 --> 00:36:20,910 and parts of DEF CON, 875 00:36:20,910 --> 00:36:23,640 but we don't have just one single DEF CON swag bag 876 00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,343 because DEF CON does not accept corporate sponsors. 877 00:36:28,890 --> 00:36:29,723 - Yeah, we'll clap that. 878 00:36:29,723 --> 00:36:30,556 That is good. 879 00:36:30,556 --> 00:36:31,389 That's a good thing. 880 00:36:31,389 --> 00:36:33,753 (audience applauding) 881 00:36:33,753 --> 00:36:35,606 - Great explanation. 882 00:36:35,606 --> 00:36:37,506 - I think we had a question over here. 883 00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:39,930 - [Attendee 3] Sorry if I stutter, 884 00:36:39,930 --> 00:36:43,050 but how would someone go about getting into hacking? 885 00:36:43,050 --> 00:36:45,990 This is coming from knowledge on basic networking and stuff, 886 00:36:45,990 --> 00:36:49,200 but how would someone teenager or hell even adult 887 00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:51,720 go into hacking at all? 888 00:36:51,720 --> 00:36:53,790 - You gotta Makerspace in your community? 889 00:36:53,790 --> 00:36:56,160 Sorry I'm like shameless plug for Makerspace but yeah, 890 00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:57,390 you got a Makerspace in your community? 891 00:36:57,390 --> 00:36:59,223 You gotta hacker space? 892 00:37:01,170 --> 00:37:02,760 That's a great place to start 893 00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:04,890 because you're gonna get direct feedback from people 894 00:37:04,890 --> 00:37:07,200 and people will engage with you. 895 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:10,038 - There are also local DEF CON groups 896 00:37:10,038 --> 00:37:12,720 and a lot of cities all over the world. 897 00:37:12,720 --> 00:37:15,390 So that would be my first place where I would start 898 00:37:15,390 --> 00:37:17,880 was I would look up online 899 00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:21,213 whether or not there was a DEF CON group in my city. 900 00:37:22,140 --> 00:37:24,180 If not, then I would look at a hacker space. 901 00:37:24,180 --> 00:37:27,570 There are a lot of even just hacker collectives 902 00:37:27,570 --> 00:37:29,443 that exist in a lot of cities. 903 00:37:29,443 --> 00:37:31,176 So at least from my experience, 904 00:37:31,176 --> 00:37:32,718 having somebody in my town 905 00:37:32,718 --> 00:37:35,790 that I can meet with in meet space 906 00:37:35,790 --> 00:37:38,270 is where I would start and what I would recommend. 907 00:37:38,270 --> 00:37:43,270 But even for kids, there's a lot of free resources online. 908 00:37:43,438 --> 00:37:47,310 Just be really, again as Sparky was saying earlier, 909 00:37:47,310 --> 00:37:50,430 be really careful about the environments 910 00:37:50,430 --> 00:37:51,690 that we're teaching people in 911 00:37:51,690 --> 00:37:53,586 because we don't wanna see kids 912 00:37:53,586 --> 00:37:55,900 accidentally end up in legal trouble 913 00:37:55,900 --> 00:37:59,310 because they unknowingly crossed a line. 914 00:37:59,310 --> 00:38:00,733 So look for those resources online 915 00:38:00,733 --> 00:38:03,107 that are giving you a safe environment 916 00:38:03,107 --> 00:38:07,502 rather than having the kids just hack all over the internet 917 00:38:07,502 --> 00:38:09,334 'cause we need those skills. 918 00:38:09,334 --> 00:38:10,800 We need that talent. 919 00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:14,793 We don't wanna lose them to the legal process. 920 00:38:15,838 --> 00:38:16,922 - There's one back there. 921 00:38:16,922 --> 00:38:18,622 - I think the goon has a question. 922 00:38:20,490 --> 00:38:22,500 - After this one, we have time for one more, 923 00:38:22,500 --> 00:38:24,542 so the one in the back will be the last one. 924 00:38:24,542 --> 00:38:25,375 - [Attendee 4] Yes, 925 00:38:25,375 --> 00:38:27,660 so mainly I'm a backend software engineer. 926 00:38:27,660 --> 00:38:29,370 I mainly write APIs and ghosts. 927 00:38:29,370 --> 00:38:30,750 So I'm not exactly a hacker, 928 00:38:30,750 --> 00:38:32,910 but what would be a suggestion that you give to me 929 00:38:32,910 --> 00:38:36,510 to gain some expertise from the great people here 930 00:38:36,510 --> 00:38:38,070 so that what it is I write 931 00:38:38,070 --> 00:38:40,530 is not riddled with vulnerabilities? 932 00:38:40,530 --> 00:38:43,260 Any particular places I should go? 933 00:38:43,260 --> 00:38:45,630 - I just wanna note that we found the unicorn, 934 00:38:45,630 --> 00:38:48,446 a developer who doesn't wanna write insecure code. 935 00:38:48,446 --> 00:38:50,907 (audience applauding and cheering) 936 00:38:50,907 --> 00:38:51,740 - There you go. 937 00:38:57,600 --> 00:38:59,493 - Any advice from our panelists? 938 00:39:01,260 --> 00:39:02,093 - There's definitely, 939 00:39:02,093 --> 00:39:02,926 probably some interesting stuff 940 00:39:02,926 --> 00:39:04,020 for you in Blue Team Village. 941 00:39:04,020 --> 00:39:05,850 I don't know what it is you work in. 942 00:39:05,850 --> 00:39:08,190 There's also the Cloud Village as well 943 00:39:08,190 --> 00:39:10,590 which could have some interesting stuff for you. 944 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,500 - I'll be speaking at the Blue Team Village this afternoon, 945 00:39:16,500 --> 00:39:17,333 so come. 946 00:39:21,090 --> 00:39:23,297 We have different things going on 947 00:39:23,297 --> 00:39:24,407 in our village as well too 948 00:39:24,407 --> 00:39:26,250 so you can come there as well. 949 00:39:26,250 --> 00:39:27,840 You are welcome. 950 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:31,080 - The other place I'll recommend is the AppSec Village. 951 00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:33,240 So they do a lot of stuff around pen testing, 952 00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:36,180 software quality testing and all of that. 953 00:39:36,180 --> 00:39:37,260 So that's another good place 954 00:39:37,260 --> 00:39:40,387 to meet other software developers who care about security. 955 00:39:40,387 --> 00:39:43,263 - I'll probably definitely plus one the AppSec Village. 956 00:39:44,253 --> 00:39:47,435 You're already two thirds of the way there. 957 00:39:47,435 --> 00:39:50,543 I mean the fact that you will stand up publicly 958 00:39:50,543 --> 00:39:53,490 and say that you do not want to write insecure code 959 00:39:53,490 --> 00:39:56,970 is the right step forward. 960 00:39:56,970 --> 00:39:58,890 I can't tell you how many dev meetings I'm in, 961 00:39:58,890 --> 00:40:01,607 where they're like, "Nah, we'll take care of it afterwards." 962 00:40:02,970 --> 00:40:04,470 - Nope. 963 00:40:04,470 --> 00:40:06,330 - All right, last one in the back. 964 00:40:06,330 --> 00:40:07,170 - [Attendee 4] Yes. 965 00:40:07,170 --> 00:40:10,950 I'm here attending the conference with my wife. 966 00:40:10,950 --> 00:40:14,492 My wife is not here for DEF CON though. 967 00:40:14,492 --> 00:40:16,347 I only have the pass for me. 968 00:40:16,347 --> 00:40:18,600 Are there any events or meetups 969 00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:21,400 or anything of that nature where we can attend together? 970 00:40:23,550 --> 00:40:24,510 - That is a good question 971 00:40:24,510 --> 00:40:26,793 that I truthfully don't know the answer to, 972 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:31,320 but if you will come find me after this 973 00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:34,170 and we can exchange contact info so I can find out 974 00:40:34,170 --> 00:40:35,003 and I'll let you know. 975 00:40:35,003 --> 00:40:38,970 I'll also have the DEF CON Twitter handle tweet out 976 00:40:38,970 --> 00:40:39,990 whatever I find out. 977 00:40:39,990 --> 00:40:43,080 So if other folks are interested in that information, 978 00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:46,230 watch the DEF CON Twitter handle and we'll get that out. 979 00:40:46,230 --> 00:40:49,473 But that is a great question, thank you for asking that. 980 00:40:49,473 --> 00:40:51,903 - That actually brings up a great message 981 00:40:51,903 --> 00:40:54,240 that I would love to share. 982 00:40:54,240 --> 00:40:55,830 One year I brought my husband, 983 00:40:55,830 --> 00:40:59,888 I got him a badge and he loved it and he's in HR. 984 00:40:59,888 --> 00:41:03,780 He's not a hacker, but he loved it. 985 00:41:03,780 --> 00:41:05,250 He went in the Lock Picking Village 986 00:41:05,250 --> 00:41:06,600 and he sat down for an hour 987 00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:08,437 and he came out and he was just like, 988 00:41:08,437 --> 00:41:09,840 "I know how to pick locks." 989 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:11,010 I was so proud of him. 990 00:41:11,010 --> 00:41:11,880 I was so proud. 991 00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:12,713 And then I was like, 992 00:41:12,713 --> 00:41:14,490 "Don't tell your boss 'cause you're HR. 993 00:41:14,490 --> 00:41:17,000 You probably shouldn't know how to do that." 994 00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:21,060 Bring people who are not hackers to the convention 995 00:41:21,060 --> 00:41:22,980 and share the wealth of knowledge 996 00:41:22,980 --> 00:41:25,860 because oftentimes you can find a village 997 00:41:25,860 --> 00:41:27,750 that they will absolutely love. 998 00:41:27,750 --> 00:41:28,890 - Oh yeah. - Yeah. 999 00:41:28,890 --> 00:41:29,979 For sure, 1000 00:41:29,979 --> 00:41:34,200 I brought my wife once to DEF CON 1001 00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:37,530 and nine months later my son was born. 1002 00:41:37,530 --> 00:41:40,530 So there are other events. 1003 00:41:40,530 --> 00:41:41,430 - Congratulations. 1004 00:41:44,010 --> 00:41:46,290 - We happily named him Flynn too. 1005 00:41:46,290 --> 00:41:50,610 - So yeah, what village was that? 1006 00:41:50,610 --> 00:41:51,443 - It's invite only. 1007 00:41:51,443 --> 00:41:53,510 (panelist laughing) 1008 00:41:53,510 --> 00:41:57,930 No, there's tons of stuff to do with your significant other 1009 00:41:57,930 --> 00:42:00,840 and that's the beauty of it. 1010 00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:02,040 We are a community, 1011 00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:03,330 as Jeff said earlier, 1012 00:42:03,330 --> 00:42:07,950 of artists and lock pickers and phone freaks 1013 00:42:07,950 --> 00:42:10,233 and there's just so many different things. 1014 00:42:11,589 --> 00:42:14,643 There's always something to find. 1015 00:42:14,643 --> 00:42:17,190 If you're really, really having a hard time, 1016 00:42:17,190 --> 00:42:20,130 just go see a fantastic singer. 1017 00:42:20,130 --> 00:42:21,200 Right, there you go. 1018 00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:23,610 Go see a fantastic performer. - A lot here. 1019 00:42:23,610 --> 00:42:25,320 - Yeah, yeah. 1020 00:42:25,320 --> 00:42:27,960 - So, are you saying DEF CON changes lives? 1021 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:28,793 - Oh damn. 1022 00:42:28,793 --> 00:42:31,200 (panelist laughing) 1023 00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:32,280 - I didn't laugh. 1024 00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:33,660 - Okay, changed your life. 1025 00:42:33,660 --> 00:42:34,980 - I haven't brought him. 1026 00:42:34,980 --> 00:42:36,953 I am hoping for roots 1027 00:42:36,953 --> 00:42:39,663 or sorry the new version of it. 1028 00:42:42,060 --> 00:42:45,570 I personally believe that DEF CON 1029 00:42:45,570 --> 00:42:50,283 may have to sponsor my child to attend, 1030 00:42:52,380 --> 00:42:53,213 concerns there. 1031 00:42:54,360 --> 00:42:55,193 - Awesome. 1032 00:42:55,193 --> 00:42:56,700 Well that's all the time that we have for today. 1033 00:42:56,700 --> 00:42:58,577 How about a round of applause for our panelists? 1034 00:42:58,577 --> 00:43:01,744 (audience applauding) 1035 00:43:06,150 --> 00:43:07,530 So thank you so much everybody 1036 00:43:07,530 --> 00:43:10,170 for starting your DEF CON 30 with us here today 1037 00:43:10,170 --> 00:43:12,042 and welcome to DEF CON. 1038 00:43:12,042 --> 00:43:13,670 (panelist cheering) 1039 00:43:13,670 --> 00:43:16,883 - Welcome to DEFCON, half the planet.