1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,040 This is the tamper-evident village at DEF CON 30. 2 00:00:03,040 --> 00:00:07,420 And what's interesting is another type of physical security bypass, isn't it? 3 00:00:07,420 --> 00:00:08,060 Yes. 4 00:00:08,300 --> 00:00:16,780 So at the tamper-evident village, there's, I think of, when I think of tamper-evidence, I think about like the zip ties around stuff, which are like one-way zip ties. 5 00:00:16,780 --> 00:00:25,340 And then these type of labels, where when you rip them off, it leaves some of the, like a lot of it behind. 6 00:00:25,340 --> 00:00:29,960 Now that's being cardboard, I understand it's a little different, but it leaves kind of this residue behind. 7 00:00:30,700 --> 00:00:32,540 What is tamper-evident? 8 00:00:32,540 --> 00:00:34,920 Like, can you just kind of put a definition a little bit to it? 9 00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:35,040 Sure . 10 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,640 So tamper-evident is technology that is adjacent to locks. 11 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:42,060 So locks are meant to keep people out of your thing for some period of time. 12 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:51,860 Tamper-evident is made to show that somebody tried to access your thing, whether it's a shipping package, an envelope, a safe, a shipping container, whatever it is, right? 13 00:00:51,860 --> 00:00:57,840 I think I even remember, didn't like some of the old phones for the hardware hacking village. 14 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:05,920 I know like to void a warranty, for instance, you open it up and it might either rip a chip off or it just shows that, hey, you've voided the warranty by opening it. 15 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:05,920 Yeah . 16 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:08,920 Most electronics have some form of adhesive seal. 17 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,440 That's like a warranty sticker or something like that. 18 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:17,840 And here you start finding, and within this village, you start finding vulnerabilities for these type of tamper-evident. 19 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:18,240 Yes. 20 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:19,120 And you have one of them. 21 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:24,560 You're going to show me a demo right now of how you would go about pulling off one of these pieces of tape. 22 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:24,920 Yep. 23 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:25,920 Let's jump in. 24 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:28,540 What do I have to do to be able to pull this thing off? 25 00:01:28,620 --> 00:01:28,800 Okay. 26 00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:30,920 So there's lots of different ways to attack it. 27 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:32,900 You can go with temperature, hot or cold. 28 00:01:32,900 --> 00:01:39,620 We're going to use chemicals just because it's easier and less likely for people to hurt themselves here at DEF CON and lots of other things. 29 00:01:39,680 --> 00:01:45,820 But the goal is that if this is your package, when you get it on, you receive your package, it looks the same to you. 30 00:01:45,820 --> 00:01:47,560 You go, yes, there's no residue. 31 00:01:47,760 --> 00:01:51,520 The tape hasn't been damaged or ripped off or cut or anything like that. 32 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:52,620 So chemical... 33 00:01:52,620 --> 00:02:00,080 I imagine like a practical application that we've seen be exploited is with like crypto wallets, like the Ledger crypto wallets. 34 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:05,920 What happens is they take them, they open the package, they set a private key, they write it down. 35 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:10,960 Then they repackage it, put all the tamper evidence stuff back on and then sell that. 36 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:11,160 Yeah. 37 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:12,340 It applies to anything, right? 38 00:02:12,340 --> 00:02:14,920 So if your company orders servers, right? 39 00:02:14,920 --> 00:02:16,140 They get shipped to you. 40 00:02:16,140 --> 00:02:21,420 What if somebody intercepts it, tampers the package, affects your hardware, changes your firmware, whatever, right? 41 00:02:21,420 --> 00:02:26,400 So basically anything, mail, shipping, cargo related can be tampered, right? 42 00:02:26,620 --> 00:02:32,240 And usually the goal is not theft because if you're just going to steal it and it's going to be missing anyway, you just rip this off, right? 43 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:39,240 So obviously chemistry is a big subject, but we're just using acetone on these tapes here. 44 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:46,120 Acetone doesn't work for every single thing, but for the most part, it's a pretty decent accessible solvent for most people. 45 00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:46,980 Now I'm a noob. 46 00:02:46,980 --> 00:02:49,980 For acetone, can anyone pick this up? 47 00:02:49,980 --> 00:02:50,800 Do you need a license? 48 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:54,220 Where would you go picking this up if you wanted to learn some of this? 49 00:02:54,220 --> 00:02:58,920 So this is just, at least in the US, this is just hardware store acetone. 50 00:02:58,920 --> 00:03:01,920 It's pure acetone, like 90 plus percent pure. 51 00:03:02,340 --> 00:03:06,580 If you don't have access to that, you can also get it from drugstore as nail polish remover. 52 00:03:06,580 --> 00:03:10,340 The only downside to nail polish remover is that number one, it's usually weaker. 53 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:15,960 Number two, it usually has dyes or perfumes in it, which might affect your ability to tamper. 54 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:18,560 You don't want to leave like a blue circle. 55 00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:19,460 No, that makes sense. 56 00:03:19,460 --> 00:03:23,620 Okay, so it's just like standard hardware, I can pick it up, Home Depot or something like that? 57 00:03:23,620 --> 00:03:23,940 Yeah . 58 00:03:24,540 --> 00:03:26,240 So what we're going to do is, I'm going to... 59 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:33,500 By the way, I love how you say hot or cold is dangerous at DEF CON, yet you go ahead and you're like, one second, let me grab this needle out right now. 60 00:03:33,500 --> 00:03:35,260 Well, we used to use hypodermic needles. 61 00:03:35,260 --> 00:03:37,600 I actually prefer them, but we're using industrial needles. 62 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:37,820 Okay. 63 00:03:37,820 --> 00:03:40,260 So you can't hurt yourself, at least not as easily. 64 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:43,480 I'm propping it up just to help gravity do it. 65 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:49,460 One of the advantages of cardboard is that you can, it's absorbent, so it'll soak up the solvent. 66 00:03:49,740 --> 00:03:52,320 But I'm just putting a little bit here. 67 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:53,640 That was a lot. 68 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,920 Yeah, I know you're at an awkward angle to get it on camera, so... 69 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:05,340 Yeah, well, I'm doing the angle so that it flows down so that when I start picking this up, the cardboard will soak it up. 70 00:04:05,340 --> 00:04:07,400 Oh, wow, it works that fast? 71 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:07,980 Oh, yeah. 72 00:04:08,100 --> 00:04:09,680 And you'll notice this is still sticky, right? 73 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:15,600 So this is still stuck to, thank you, to my tongue depressor here. 74 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:21,900 And I'm using the tongue depressor just so I don't mar the finish or, if you're working with your hands, to not leave fingerprints. 75 00:04:24,890 --> 00:04:26,070 But it works pretty quick. 76 00:04:26,070 --> 00:04:28,050 And you'll notice this is sticky still. 77 00:04:29,350 --> 00:04:31,530 So I'm gonna let this soak for a second. 78 00:04:31,610 --> 00:04:33,690 But you'll see this is already evaporating. 79 00:04:33,990 --> 00:04:40,910 Yeah, so that was what I was just thinking is, would the water damage the box, or not water, but would the acetone damage the box? 80 00:04:40,910 --> 00:04:42,350 And I see it drying already. 81 00:04:42,350 --> 00:04:45,110 Yeah, for most cardboard and most acetone, it won't. 82 00:04:45,110 --> 00:04:51,350 If you use a lot, you might stress the fibers of the cardboard, or think of like a paper that gets wet, it gets kind of wavy. 83 00:04:52,090 --> 00:04:53,770 But for the most part, it's fine. 84 00:04:53,770 --> 00:04:56,450 This board was just a random board we picked off the table. 85 00:04:57,170 --> 00:05:00,250 And it may have been done dozens of times over the weekend. 86 00:05:02,050 --> 00:05:03,630 That is incredible. 87 00:05:03,870 --> 00:05:05,570 I can't believe how fast it was. 88 00:05:05,570 --> 00:05:07,010 Yeah , you'll see it's already drying. 89 00:05:08,630 --> 00:05:11,390 I mean, if it was a giant box, you can just kind of wave it a little bit. 90 00:05:11,390 --> 00:05:11,890 No, I'm just kidding. 91 00:05:11,890 --> 00:05:21,570 Yeah, I mean, generally, you open the package, you're doing something with the contents for some period of time, photographing it, modifying it, it's like computer hardware or software kind of thing. 92 00:05:21,670 --> 00:05:26,230 I imagine with the tamper evidence stuff, also, there's multiple attack paths. 93 00:05:26,230 --> 00:05:28,070 This one is removing it. 94 00:05:28,070 --> 00:05:38,670 The other one might be like buying more of that, like going, finding the manufacturer of that specific tape and say, okay, cool, I can just, I can remove it, but I can also put a new piece on. 95 00:05:38,670 --> 00:05:43,030 Exactly, so this specific piece of tape doesn't have any serial number. 96 00:05:43,750 --> 00:05:47,830 The lines are made so that if you cut it, it's very hard to realign the lines, like visually. 97 00:05:48,130 --> 00:05:52,090 Some of the others we ripped it up, but you can see there's a serial number on this one. 98 00:05:53,210 --> 00:05:58,050 So if you just try to replace this, in theory, the person should see, hey, my serial number changed. 99 00:05:58,630 --> 00:06:05,970 Just depends on, there's a person, no matter if it's adhesive or mechanical or electronic, there's a person in the loop that says, yes, that is good or not. 100 00:06:05,970 --> 00:06:14,910 So part of this is fighting technology, part of it is fighting the person, like if they don't check the serial number, then maybe you can get away with putting another one that looks the same. 101 00:06:14,930 --> 00:06:17,730 So at this point, it's dry, pretty much dry, yeah. 102 00:06:17,790 --> 00:06:22,210 Did that dissolve all of the, I guess, the glue on the thing? 103 00:06:22,210 --> 00:06:23,510 Speaking of which, sorry, you reminded me not to do face down. 104 00:06:23,510 --> 00:06:24,710 Or on the piece of tape. 105 00:06:25,610 --> 00:06:27,530 So it actually doesn't dissolve the glue. 106 00:06:27,650 --> 00:06:33,490 What it does is it creates a buffer between the adhesive layer of the tape and the surface of, in this case, cardboard. 107 00:06:33,510 --> 00:06:36,370 So it basically causes it to float up off. 108 00:06:36,370 --> 00:06:37,690 So that's why it's still sticky. 109 00:06:37,690 --> 00:06:38,910 It doesn't dissolve the tape. 110 00:06:38,910 --> 00:06:45,110 Maybe over like, if we tamper this, Yeah, in theory, true attack, you're only doing it once. 111 00:06:45,110 --> 00:06:47,210 In the village, you're doing it over and over. 112 00:06:47,210 --> 00:06:49,690 So again, like this board, who knows how many times. 113 00:06:49,690 --> 00:06:53,090 So we open it up, we modify hardware, we put it back. 114 00:06:53,090 --> 00:06:54,730 Are we able to just stick it right back on? 115 00:06:54,730 --> 00:06:56,190 Oh yeah, it's sticky right now. 116 00:06:56,190 --> 00:07:03,450 So now that it's dry, and professionally, we would take a photo and measure this and put it back in the same spot, but it doesn't matter. 117 00:07:03,450 --> 00:07:07,450 To get it off the last little bit, we're just gonna take a little bit of acetone. 118 00:07:08,670 --> 00:07:11,030 It's amazing, it's even stuck to that. 119 00:07:11,850 --> 00:07:13,670 Give that a second to dry. 120 00:07:14,730 --> 00:07:16,550 But it's back to what it was. 121 00:07:16,550 --> 00:07:18,330 This is so cool. 122 00:07:18,330 --> 00:07:24,150 I know I say this for so many videos, but this legitimately is so cool. 123 00:07:24,430 --> 00:07:26,810 I have, this is the first time I've experienced this. 124 00:07:26,810 --> 00:07:27,590 This is awesome. 125 00:07:27,750 --> 00:07:28,390 Thank you. 126 00:07:28,390 --> 00:07:31,390 If someone wants to research more, I guess this is the question. 127 00:07:31,410 --> 00:07:34,970 If you want to research more about this, where would they go? 128 00:07:34,970 --> 00:07:35,910 Is there a forum? 129 00:07:35,910 --> 00:07:38,150 Is there a DEF CON forum they can look at? 130 00:07:38,150 --> 00:07:38,870 Not really. 131 00:07:38,870 --> 00:07:43,590 So I gave a talk about it at some number DEF CON, I don't remember, a while ago. 132 00:07:44,230 --> 00:07:45,310 What's your handle? 133 00:07:45,310 --> 00:07:46,970 I'm Datagram, by the way, hi. 134 00:07:48,030 --> 00:07:49,610 There's not really a lot of info on it. 135 00:07:49,610 --> 00:07:55,390 You can find some scattered YouTube videos of people doing individual tapes or individual mechanical seals. 136 00:07:55,610 --> 00:07:57,050 There's really not a lot of info. 137 00:07:57,350 --> 00:08:05,990 I wanted to troll and say tamperwiki.com, because it's a website I made a long time ago that I never did anything with, that people are really upset that I haven't filled out information for. 138 00:08:06,330 --> 00:08:08,550 But yeah, sorry, there's not a lot of info. 139 00:08:08,550 --> 00:08:11,450 There's some talks, like I said, my talk from Black Hat DEF CON. 140 00:08:11,450 --> 00:08:12,550 Or come to DEF CON. 141 00:08:12,550 --> 00:08:13,470 Or come to DEF CON, yeah. 142 00:08:13,470 --> 00:08:14,630 And figure it out. 143 00:08:14,670 --> 00:08:15,870 Thank you so much. 144 00:08:15,870 --> 00:08:17,370 Thanks for watching. 145 00:08:17,370 --> 00:08:19,630 And as always, hack on.